FUMBBL :: Online Blood Bowl League

Joined: Jan 17, 2006

Posted: Feb 03, 2006 - 21:36

OK, I'm a veteran BB coach but still relatively new to FUMBBL and haven't had teams with the longevity that you do here. I understand the basic theory of keeping your TS high vs TR low and getting handicaps, but could someone go over some of the general strategy rules-of-thumb? I've seen references to sacking players with nigglings, burning excess money, etc. but couldn't find a post that covered all the basics of "how to work the system", so to speak.

Thanks!
Smile

Imerikol

Joined: Aug 05, 2004

Posted: Feb 03, 2006 - 21:52

There are two TR/TS related meta-gaming strategies depending on your goals.

In all cases, you want a healthy, powerful team. That means no niggles and as few MNG players as possible. You also don't want a lot of idle cash/coaches.

If your goal is to win games, you want a low TR and high TS. With a team set up like this, your goal is to challenge around your TS or lower and use the fact that your TR is relatively low to get handicaps or avoid letting the other person have them.

If your goal is to farm coach rating, you want a team that is relatively powerful compared to it's TS and seek out opponents appropriate for your team. The idea is you pick games by your TR and let the opponent have a hollow TS advantage. Since defeating teams of higher TS means better CR gains, it's a good way to play even lower ranked coaches and still have decent CR gains. Teams that are known for being good at this are Ogres and flings, both of which sport a TS well below their potential effectiveness, though with flings you generally need to be giving up handicaps and playing lower end teams. Ogres can play just about anyone and, if you're good, you can have a decent win%.

If you don't care about either of these meta-gaming goals (and you shouldn't), jsut play against fairly evenly matched teams, the higher the opponent's CR the better. Believe it or not, even if you suck, playing the higher CR coaches will raise your CR to heights you probably would never get by playing other low rated coaches. This is because everyone has bad dice sometimes and you can pull a win here and there on luck with a little skill. You might just learn something too.

Thats it for now.

Fool

Joined: Sep 16, 2004

Posted: Feb 03, 2006 - 21:52

retiring nigglers and spending money are both good advice to keep your tr/ts ration in good shape. I find that the benefit of assitant coaches and cheerleaders are neglible, and keeping these low (or zero) also helps. Also, don't buy excess rerolls (more than 5 or 6) unless you're playing a team that really needs them (vampires, ogres, etc).

JanMattys

Joined: Feb 29, 2004

Posted: Feb 03, 2006 - 21:54

The more spps are spread and equally divided by team members, the more your TS will raise above your TR.

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torsoboy

Joined: Nov 23, 2004

Posted: Feb 03, 2006 - 23:33

Do observe the two TR/TS situations that look alike but confer massive advantage difference:

A high TR low TS team could be one of the following:
1. a team that has no injuries but a lot of cash in stock
2. a team that has no cash but a lot of injuries or players missing

Due to the rule that you may hire stars, wizards etc. after agreeing to a game, you could save money, challenge some crippled team, then spend the cash on some star to increase your win chances further. Of course, most coaches will say no, but Fumbbl is so large that you'll find one of these match ups eventually. It's totally unfair and retarded though, but it's still the rules.

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JanMattys

Joined: Feb 29, 2004

Posted: Feb 03, 2006 - 23:41

torsoboy wrote:

Do observe the two TR/TS situations that look alike but confer massive advantage difference:

A high TR low TS team could be one of the following:
1. a team that has no injuries but a lot of cash in stock
2. a team that has no cash but a lot of injuries or players missing

Due to the rule that you may hire stars, wizards etc. after agreeing to a game, you could save money, challenge some crippled team, then spend the cash on some star to increase your win chances further. Of course, most coaches will say no, but Fumbbl is so large that you'll find one of these match ups eventually. It's totally unfair and retarded though, but it's still the rules.

Bad boy for giving such advice away...
Hiring Stars is a pre-game sequence that both players should do at the SAME time in tabletop. In the client we can't, so the host has a disadvantage cause he must decide wether he should hire a star or not before creating the game, while the client can wait, see, and THEN decide basing upon the choices of the host.

So please, DO NOT hire Stars without telling your opponent.
It's just lame,

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torsoboy

Joined: Nov 23, 2004

Posted: Feb 03, 2006 - 23:42

I know it's lame, but that's the rules as it is interpreted for me.

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Dominik

Joined: Oct 29, 2004

Posted: Feb 03, 2006 - 23:44

It could also mean a team has some players with spp + 100, you collect and collect spp but don't get every 6 or 15spp a new skill.
The higher the status of a player, the more expensive skills become.

zerkalo

Joined: Dec 12, 2005

Posted: Feb 04, 2006 - 00:37

So how to have the weaker team, but still get handicap(s). Well, this is close to cherrypicking, passive version of it.

Well to add just some tip: on high av or regen teams it is better to have 11-12 expensive players than 16 players with mostly linemen... If TS are even and you have 16 players and the opponent 11, he will rule at the start of the game. And if he has high av, thick skulls, regens, apo etc, then he will likely get to play 11vs11 after td, or 2nd half. Even TS but he wins 3-0 - why? Because it would have been better to get 1 blitzer than 3 linemen.

Tricktickler

Joined: Jul 10, 2004

Posted: Feb 04, 2006 - 01:13

My best advice is to not bother with TS since it doesnt affect anything (only how CR is calculated).

Last edited by Tricktickler on %b %04, %2006 - %03:%Feb; edited 1 time in total

torsoboy

Joined: Nov 23, 2004

Posted: Feb 04, 2006 - 01:16

Tricktickler wrote:

My best advice is to not bother about TS since it doesnt affect anything (only how CR is calculated).

Gamefinder selects matchups primarily on TS. It's up to the coaches to agree to a fair match, but most people think equal TS makes a fair match (and it does most of the time, but not always).

Plorg

Joined: May 08, 2005

Posted: Feb 04, 2006 - 03:14

JanMattys wrote:

The more spps are spread and equally divided by team members, the more your TS will raise above your TR.

Dominik wrote:

It could also mean a team has some players with spp + 100, you collect and collect spp but don't get every 6 or 15spp a new skill.
The higher the status of a player, the more expensive skills become.

Another way of restating this:
Maximize the total number of skills / the total number of spp.
TR increases directly from the total number of spp your team has,
but your team actually becomes more powerful by having more skills.

For example, the optimal distribution of 60 spp over 10 players
is for each player to have 6 spp (one skill) each.
With the same total 60 spp, for any player to have two skills (16 spp),
there are two other players that don't have enough to gain one skill,
so your team as a whole loses a skill but has the same TR.

This is why you'll occasionally see perfectly good highly skilled uninjured players get retired from venerable teams when the rest of the team has been reduced to mostly fresh unskilled players.

CircularLogic

Joined: Aug 22, 2003

Posted: Feb 04, 2006 - 05:14

Imerikol wrote:

Since defeating teams of higher TS means better CR gains, it's a good way to play even lower ranked coaches and still have decent CR gains.

No, No and tripple NO!

The impact TS has on your CR gain is neglectable compared to the CR. When I play against a CR 160-coach the system expects me to win with a TS 100 team against TS 190ish or higher - a matchup even a lobotomized chimpanse would win against me. The diffence between barely legal (40 TS dif) and even match is app. 70% more gain... that`s just not worth it.

maxlongstreet

Joined: Oct 18, 2005

Posted: Feb 04, 2006 - 06:09

I completely agree with Circular Logic on this point. The system overweight's opponent's CR is comparison to TS. Which is a shame because the system should encourage good coaches to challenge up in TS to test their skills, and in fact it does the opposite--It encourages them to cherrypick downwards on TS (not CR).

Malthor

Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Posted: Feb 04, 2006 - 07:04

An alternate way to look at it is that the system is designed to make it extremely hard to maintain a high CR, and it is deliberately weighted NOT because you are expected to win with a 100TS team vs 190TS team with a CR coach, but to make it a frustrating exercise if your focus is on maintaining a very high CR.

It is just a balance/philosophy thing. It is just a system with its pros and cons, and is not really an accurate reflection of coaching ability nor chance of winning/losing with mismatched teams.

All a high CR tells me is that the person is experienced. Nothing else really, certainly not how good they are or their chance of beating me with even teams and even dice.

CircularLogic wrote:

Imerikol wrote:

Since defeating teams of higher TS means better CR gains, it's a good way to play even lower ranked coaches and still have decent CR gains.

No, No and tripple NO!

The impact TS has on your CR gain is neglectable compared to the CR. When I play against a CR 160-coach the system expects me to win with a TS 100 team against TS 190ish or higher - a matchup even a lobotomized chimpanse would win against me. The diffence between barely legal (40 TS dif) and even match is app. 70% more gain... that`s just not worth it.

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