Mr_Foulscumm
Joined: Mar 05, 2005
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 Posted:
Dec 27, 2006 - 22:02 |
 
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This doesn't sound like a nerf of fouling at all... |
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BigMac
Joined: Dec 19, 2004
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| Posted:
Dec 27, 2006 - 22:17 |
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Well, lets look at the Player Actions:
Move
Block
Blitz
Pass
Hand Off
Foul
Did i miss one? Gaze doesnt't count, it just a skill for the move action.
Blitz costs a square of movement, but allows you to carry on moving.
Pass, and Hand Off (and Foul!) do not cost a square of movement.
So if there was a tweak that made Fouls cost a square, then it would make sence to align it with Blitz.
Obviously, right now it is aligned with Pass and Hand Off. (free, but not allowed to carry on moving).
It is still supposed to be a nerf, since it reduces the range for Dirty Players to reach their targets by one square.
The ability to cary on moving is a big deal towards protecting your dirty player however. |
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Meech
Joined: Sep 15, 2005
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| Posted:
Dec 27, 2006 - 22:20 |
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Since you aren't suggesting this as a Fumbbl change I will play along.
Why not make it allowed that a player do any of those actions (Hand off, Pass or Foul) and keep moving. Is a Dirty player more important than a skilled thrower? I would say not generally. Your suggestion would unbalance things towards fouling more. |
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BigMac
Joined: Dec 19, 2004
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| Posted:
Dec 27, 2006 - 22:37 |
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Well this is about nerfing fouling. I posted some more suggestions in the opening posting, just didn't get around to present them in detail yet. (i had hit the Submit button over Preview...) Well, imho the reduced range protects teams from beeing fouled quite a bit. Hard to tell since we all are used to playing with JBB/FUMBBL, but if you imagine for a second a update for JBB, making things "right", there would be massive whining again. So i think making it cost a square is relatively undisputed. Allowing to cary on moving however, lik i said, Blitz plays this way. So my feeling is game mechanics should not be to diffrent to simpfy things.
I like the idea of "this works like a Blitz but you get to hit a prone player".
Extending this to other Actions strays too far from "tempering with the fouling rules".
For me, its either "like a blitz" or "like a pass". A third way (cost + movement stop) isn't in the game right now.
It seems less interesting, and makes things a little bit more difficult. I'd give moving a try.
Might as well be personal preference. The ideaa of killing an Elf and then Scoring the Winning touchdown in one Action turns me on ^^ |
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Fama
Joined: Feb 09, 2005
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| Posted:
Dec 27, 2006 - 22:44 |
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| BigMac wrote: |
It is still supposed to be a nerf, since it reduces the range for Dirty Players to reach their targets by one square.
The ability to cary on moving is a big deal towards protecting your dirty player however. |
Exactly - the ability to keep moving is very good. Usually when I foul (or see other people foul) you don't GFI, rarely someone does GFI, but I don't think that doing 2 GFI before fouling happens even in 1 game out of 100, so it's useless IMO. |
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Meech
Joined: Sep 15, 2005
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| Posted:
Dec 27, 2006 - 22:46 |
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I would consider using this suggestion (as a TT houserule, it wouldn't be worth trying to implememnt the change on Fumbbl). I think that in 3ed you could move after a foul and hand off. I can't remember 100% though.
| BigMac wrote: |
Might as well be personal preference. The ideaa of killing an Elf and then Scoring the Winning touchdown in one Action turns me on ^^ |
As it should, as it should... |
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Putting the FU in fumbbl since 9/2005 |
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BigMac
Joined: Dec 19, 2004
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| Posted:
Dec 27, 2006 - 23:29 |
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| Fama wrote: | | Usually when I foul (or see other people foul) you don't GFI, rarely someone does GFI, but I don't think that doing 2 GFI before fouling happens even in 1 game out of 100, so it's useless IMO. |
Erm Fama, we play it "wrong".
Imagine every foul on FUMBBL with +1 MA... because that is how it works "properly".
That would result in a couple more dead elves per day. |
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Fama
Joined: Feb 09, 2005
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| Posted:
Dec 27, 2006 - 23:37 |
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| BigMac wrote: | | Fama wrote: | | Usually when I foul (or see other people foul) you don't GFI, rarely someone does GFI, but I don't think that doing 2 GFI before fouling happens even in 1 game out of 100, so it's useless IMO. |
Erm Fama, we play it "wrong".
Imagine every foul on FUMBBL with +1 MA... because that is how it works "properly".
That would result in a couple more dead elves per day. |
Well, the thing is, in my opinion, it would not. Since I've been trying to say all along, that the situation where someone is a place to get fouled, but is too far away, is so rare. |
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BigMac
Joined: Dec 19, 2004
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| Posted:
Dec 27, 2006 - 23:43 |
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A Dirty Player Dwarf Longbeard has MA4 under LRB4. Here on Fumbbl, he has effectively MA3.
Since you try to use your Dirty Players for fouls, range is an issue. Again i think the way it is played on fumbbl is way better than the original rules. |
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Fama
Joined: Feb 09, 2005
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| Posted:
Dec 27, 2006 - 23:53 |
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| BigMac wrote: | A Dirty Player Dwarf Longbeard has MA4 under LRB4. Here on Fumbbl, he has effectively MA3.
Since you try to use your Dirty Players for fouls, range is an issue. Again i think the way it is played on fumbbl is way better than the original rules. |
Not at all. If you don't take GFI's into account, they're just the same. If you do, however, it's MA 5 vs. MA 6. And although with dwarves (the only place where I can really see this working - other is zombies) it can happen, I'd say it's still very rare. |
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BigMac
Joined: Dec 19, 2004
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| Posted:
Dec 28, 2006 - 00:02 |
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A GFI doesn't work automatically. Players die while they GFI!
And if there's a chance for something to go wrong, then its a nerf. |
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Macavity
Joined: Nov 23, 2004
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| Posted:
Dec 28, 2006 - 00:22 |
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Being able to o lend an assist after fouling is a boost, not a nerf. |
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Fama
Joined: Feb 09, 2005
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| Posted:
Dec 28, 2006 - 00:26 |
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| BigMac wrote: | A GFI doesn't work automatically. Players die while they GFI!
And if there's a chance for something to go wrong, then its a nerf. |
In the case of GFI in the client to foul, yes they do.
(that means that when you're next to the victim, you press GFI and then the victim, but there's no roll) |
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Side step this! |
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Mr_Foulscumm
Joined: Mar 05, 2005
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| Posted:
Dec 28, 2006 - 00:31 |
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BigMac, Everything you've said so far is making Fouling better... and if you make them better they're not a nerf... And fouling doesn't need to get better, it's quite deadly the way it is. |
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BigMac
Joined: Dec 19, 2004
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| Posted:
Dec 28, 2006 - 02:52 |
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@ Fama, really? Strange - one might imagine GFI is GFI, especially in a computer programm!
@ Mr. Foulsumm: Be sure to read once in a while before you post.
1. You don't know the way it is, you only know how it is houseruled on fumbbl because of a known bug in Java Bowl.
2. There are 3 choices on this matter:
A, Make it cost a square but allow the movement to continue.
B, Leave it how it is, which is actually quite a bit more powerful than the rules you know from FUMBBL and JBB.
C, Introduce a new game mechanic - cost a square plus not allowed to continue.
3. In order to use this FUMBBL houserule with the actual boardgame, it might make sense to align it with an existing game mechanic.
Which results in playing the Action "like a Blitz" instead of "like a Pass".
This makes the foul action "Better" over the FUMBBL houserule you know, but also nerfs the main purpose of the action, to foul a specific opponent quite a bit over the official rules.
Which is in the end exactly what i had in mind, a minor tweak, strong enough to make a diffrence, small enough not to turn things upside down.
And please be sure to read the full original post, this really is about ways to make life a litttle bit easier for the elvish teams in your league. |
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