koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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 Posted:
Sep 07, 2025 - 11:29 |
 
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| Baron-Greenback wrote: | | I see what you're saying Matt, but similarly it is conceptually ridiculous that a professional sports player can't pick up a ball at rest with nobody near them. I've never seen that happen on a rugby pitch. |
Never seen it? How often is the ball actually at rest. Just laying there. I don't watch much rugby. So you tell me.
I watch more American Football than rugby. The game that BB is more influenced by.
Kick off returns are muffed. Mainly because players don't have time to wait for the ball to come to rest. They'll have a hoard of opposing players charging towards them.
They may also be thinking of where they should run. Though of course they should secure the ball first.
Most players are told to not even try to pick up a loose ball. Just fall on it and secure possession.
American football and rugby are not turn based.
Players will try to catch the ball while it is in the air because once it bounces, it could go anywhere.
That is what I think the old rules are influenced by.
The new rule might make it a "better" game for some, but for me it goes against the old "BB spirit" and is another nail in the coffin of my interest.
But of course, everything was better in my day. Even the polio and diptheria  |
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Last edited by koadah on Sep 07, 2025; edited 1 time in total |
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MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
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| Posted:
Sep 07, 2025 - 11:55 |
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| Baron-Greenback wrote: | | I see what you're saying Matt, but similarly it is conceptually ridiculous that a professional sports player can't pick up a ball at rest with nobody near them. |
Well, in real sports there are no Zombies and Skeletons trying to pick up a ball but, if there were, it would not be a big imagination's stretch figuring that they would likely struggle to pick the ball up.
In real sports there are no spiked balls either, harder to handle than normal ones. A ball could have been greased, in Blood Bowl the balls are not always normal ones, they could have been replaced by special ones.
Do you think that it's normal and logical that an Elf without Sure Hands picks the ball as easily as a Zombie, even if with a Secure the ball action?
I don't think it's very consistent. Zombies are supposed to be clumsy and they should struggle to pick the ball up, for sure more than an Elf.
The AG stat got less valuable because it's not used when passing, now the Secure the ball is another nerf to AG, because you don't need to have AG 2+ to pick the ball up reliably. Even a Zombie or a Nurgle's Rotter can do it.
Moreover, Secure the ball makes Sure Hands less necessary than now, thus speeding up the development (because you can skip Sure Hands to take a stat or a skill). Speeding up the development is a step towards more minmaxed ball carriers, which is a negative thing.
With a +1 modifier a Human would pick the ball up on a 2+, a Zombie or a Rotter on a 3+.
Humans (who are the closest-to-real-football players) would be able to pick the ball almost surely (in terms of best odds on a D6), while Zombies, Skeletons and Rotters on a 3+, which sounds to me reliable enough for those clumsy players.
With 2+ for everybody there is no difference. |
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Lokragen
Joined: Aug 20, 2015
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Sep 07, 2025 - 12:58 |
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You've said it all. It's true that people forget that Blood Bowl simulates a real-time match every turn.
Frankly, if you protect the ball well, it generally goes very well.
It just lowers the skill cap of the game. If it allows less experienced players to challenge themselves, why not, but not if it unbalances the Bash/Agi.
However, a rule that allows a +1 for the third ball pick-up would be a good idea if no one is within two square of the ball boy. |
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MattDakka
Joined: Oct 09, 2007
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Sep 07, 2025 - 13:34 |
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| koadah wrote: |
The new rule might make it a "better" game for some, but for me it goes against the old "BB spirit" and is another nail in the coffin of my interest. |
To be honest, in Blood Bowl second edition the ball was automatically picked up with no die roll.
Page 5 of 2nd ed. Rules: "If a player moves into a square in which the football is lying, they may pick it up, and - if they wish and are able - carry on moving."
So, we could say that Secure the ball is a step closer to that old "BB spirit". 
The pick up roll was added in third edition, more recently.
That said, while I think that the automatic pick up is bad, on the other hand it should not be as hard as a 3+ for a player with AG 3+ taking their time to pick the ball up with a Secure the ball action.
2+ seems a good compromise. Not automatic, but easy and reliable enough. |
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koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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| Posted:
Sep 07, 2025 - 14:45 |
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