FUMBBL :: Online Blood Bowl League

Joined: Jun 07, 2004

Posted: Nov 13, 2008 - 01:25

I dont like the idea of forcing either, hence my first note above.

Another way of tackling the issue is to block access on one side rather than force the numbers up on the other side.

Leaving things up to individuals is often a pipedream. If we'd done that with the SWL, I'm fairly certain it would no longer exist, or at best, not be as healthy as it is now.

Optihut

Joined: Dec 16, 2004

Posted: Nov 13, 2008 - 01:28

Snorri wrote:

I dont like the idea of forcing either, hence my first note above.

Another way of tackling the issue is to block access on one side rather than force the numbers up on the other side.

That has the disadvantage of rewarding the early birds, which is favouritism. There's always going to be pros and cons, thus it is good that we are having the debate. As usual I can't fault Christer for making a decision that is in line with his stance so far.

Morton

Joined: Nov 09, 2008

Posted: Nov 13, 2008 - 01:38

My basic thought is that if I can't play the races I want to play, I just won't play. I prefer to play dorfs and they are so hard to get a game for in ranked. no racial resrtrictions. I'm sorry that you wanna be girly and not play against bashy teams but if thats truly the case then perhaps you shouldn't play Blood Bowl. Perhaps you should go play hopscotch or jump rope. Maybe collect pongs.

Optihut

Joined: Dec 16, 2004

Posted: Nov 13, 2008 - 01:57

Morton wrote:

My basic thought is that if I can't play the races I want to play, I just won't play. I prefer to play dorfs and they are so hard to get a game for in ranked. no racial resrtrictions. I'm sorry that you wanna be girly and not play against bashy teams but if thats truly the case then perhaps you shouldn't play Blood Bowl. Perhaps you should go play hopscotch or jump rope. Maybe collect pongs.

You had a point until that "girly" argument - I'm sure it's possible to dig out some less than flattering reasons for coaching dwarves as well. Stick to your first point, the rest of the banter won't convince many people, I'd wager.

Morton

Joined: Nov 09, 2008

Posted: Nov 13, 2008 - 02:00

I'm not trying to convince anyone... its just how I feel.

Ansalon

Joined: Jun 18, 2006

Posted: Nov 13, 2008 - 02:01

WG|Dark_Angel wrote:

As far as i recall, there was supposed to be some sort of ranking system. So long as the ranking formula accounts for the frequency with which the race in question is played when it rewards the players, everyone should be fine, no?

This is the most viable solution to having a bash-only division (besides jump rope). Everyone has freedom to choose what race to play and there are no changes to the LRB rules.

If less-played teams get some sort of ranking bonus for winning it will encourage competitive players to play different races. Also, it's self-adjusting to trends so it doesn't need much oversight.

Snorri

Joined: Jun 07, 2004

Posted: Nov 13, 2008 - 03:58

Morton wrote:

My basic thought is that if I can't play the races I want to play, I just won't play.

This is exactly what I'm trying to say. I don't play [R] or [B] because they dont offer anything except these skewed environments.

I'm not one who wants elf-elf games either. I just desire two things:

1) To be able to play the race I want to play and not get retired.
2) Variety

I get these in [U] with the SWL. But fumbbl's main environments lost their lustre for me a long, long time ago because they'll never do 1) or 2). And its a shame, because fumbbl mainstream could easily offer an alternative playing environment. As they are, [R] and [B] will ultimately attract similar coaches, similar races, and similar playing styles.

shadow46x2

Joined: Nov 22, 2003

Posted: Nov 13, 2008 - 04:05

Morton wrote:

My basic thought is that if I can't play the races I want to play, I just won't play. I prefer to play dorfs and they are so hard to get a game for in ranked.

congratulations for playing [B] for the completely *WRONG* reasons...

--j

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CircularLogic

Joined: Aug 22, 2003

Posted: Nov 13, 2008 - 12:06

ahalfling wrote:

I'm sure that, given the novelty of the division, some people are thinking,1) "well, now's the time to make that bashy team I always wanted to make, but didn't want to go through the trouble of getting games for." Other people are thinking, 2)"well, I've heard this division is going to be really violent, so I'm not going to play a fragile team." Both of which are perfectly valid ways of looking at the problem -- while it is a problem, while people are making teams specifically FOR the blackbox.
But eventually, people won't think that way -- they'll just be out to make a team.

You state 2 reasons why the racial lineup is initally skewed. But you draw the wrong conclusion, that because those reasons count initially, they won`t count later.
You might argue, that 1) applies only to the start. BUT, it will always be harder to get games for bashers in [R]. So this reason will always stay valid. 2) not only will stay valid over the whole time, it will get reinforced by the initial racial choice and by 1), so it`s skewed now and it will more likely get more skewed than less.

Nyberg

Joined: Jun 24, 2005

Posted: Nov 13, 2008 - 12:11

if you guys are afraid of some greenskins and other races why dont you stick with ranked? I think B is fine as it is. There is nothing wrong with orcs, chaos, dwarfs, khemri and stuff. It's a real challenge!
Sounds like you should stick with ranked Logic. Is this like your fifth thread about how bad B is?

nin

Joined: May 27, 2005

Posted: Nov 13, 2008 - 13:02

Snorri wrote:

Morton wrote:

My basic thought is that if I can't play the races I want to play, I just won't play.

This is exactly what I'm trying to say. I don't play [R] or [B] because they dont offer anything except these skewed environments.

I'm not one who wants elf-elf games either. I just desire two things:

1) To be able to play the race I want to play and not get retired.
2) Variety

I get these in [U] with the SWL. But fumbbl's main environments lost their lustre for me a long, long time ago because they'll never do 1) or 2). And its a shame, because fumbbl mainstream could easily offer an alternative playing environment. As they are, [R] and [B] will ultimately attract similar coaches, similar races, and similar playing styles.

Thre are plenty of Skaven and Elves in te BBox... and some are even succesfull (not just surviving).
And for the variety, it's still too soon to say that BBox lacs variety... I think that there are teams of every race.

CircularLogic

Joined: Aug 22, 2003

Posted: Nov 13, 2008 - 13:26

Morton wrote:

My basic thought is that if I can't play the races I want to play, I just won't play. I prefer to play dorfs and they are so hard to get a game for in ranked. no racial resrtrictions. I'm sorry that you wanna be girly and not play against bashy teams but if thats truly the case then perhaps you shouldn't play Blood Bowl. Perhaps you should go play hopscotch or jump rope. Maybe collect pongs.

[irony]
My basic thought is that if I want to bash, then someone needs to get bashed. You need to stop being a girl and play something squishy, so that I can bash. But if you can`t take it, that you have sometimes dead pixels and are sometimes even outnumbered, then perhaps you shoudln`t play Blood Bowl. Perhaps you should go play hopscotch or jump rope. Maybe collect pongs.
[/irony]

It is funny, that people that play exclusively races that are the most damage resistant call other coaches girly. It is also interesting, that coaches of bashers will refuse to coach non-bashers, but not the other way round.

Statistics from 13.11. 16:00 (only teams with at least 1 game were counted)

Code:

Rank Games Teams Race
1 210 36 Khemri
2 168 41 Dwarf
3 160 35 Chaos
4 141 37 Orc
5 134 24 Ogre
6 81 24 Dark Elf
7 79 20 Chaos Dwarf
8 73 18 Human
9 70 17 Undead
10 65 21 Skaven
11 59 13 Nurgle's Rotters
12 52 21 Lizardmen
13 52 14 High Elf
14 51 14 Wood Elf
15 44 12 Necromantic
16 42 14 Norse
17 39 6 Amazon
18 34 7 Halfling
19 26 10 Elf
20 17 7 Vampire
21 8 5 Goblin

CircularLogic

Joined: Aug 22, 2003

Posted: Nov 14, 2008 - 13:07

Data from today 13:00

Code:

Games Teams Race
245 52 Dwarf
230 41 Chaos
224 39 Khemri
209 55 Orc
161 28 Ogre
101 29 Dark Elf
96 19 Undead
95 23 Human
94 22 Chaos Dwarf
88 25 Skaven
70 15 Nurgle's Rotters
62 15 High Elf
62 18 Wood Elf
61 19 Norse
57 19 Lizardmen
55 9 Amazon
52 16 Necromantic
46 8 Halfling
39 12 Elf
23 10 Goblin
15 7 Vampire

Mithrilpoint

Joined: Mar 16, 2004

Posted: Nov 14, 2008 - 13:16

Working as intended Smile

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DukeTyrion

Joined: Feb 18, 2004

Posted: Nov 14, 2008 - 13:29

Yarrr Goblins are off the bottom \o/