Uedder
Joined: Aug 03, 2010
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 Posted:
Dec 02, 2016 - 17:37 |
 
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You don't have to read stuff to enter smacks? To even know smack exist and when they are you, at the very least, need to read a blog first. That cuts off a lot of userbase.
Then need to figure out how the tournament works, apply your team, etc... It's easy for us, who have been around this site for years.
Definetly not easier than reading 3 lines of text and clicking 2 buttons tho. |
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mrt1212
Joined: Feb 26, 2013
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| Posted:
Dec 02, 2016 - 17:44 |
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| koadah wrote: | | mrt1212 wrote: | | Uedder wrote: | | mrt1212 wrote: | Honestly, you would probably allay any fears of unfun issues if you allowed teams to be played without any stakes involved vis a vis spp, perms, gold, CR etc etc. People get to have their fun with their teams they've built in one off games of their favorites but to actually build the team you have to participate in seasons.
I have always wanted to play my teams without stakes involved to practice for leagues etc etc. |
Like test mode? |
Yeah but without the hassle. |
Non progression mode? |
Basically yes, but with the ability to use teams that opt in for progression seasons. Essentially create a gamefinder (and only a gamefinder) to allow coaches to play friendly exhibitions with their B and R teams while Bowlbot arranges games that count for seasons.
Holy crap, i just opined a desire to merge R and B. Brb, not feeling well. |
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Uedder
Joined: Aug 03, 2010
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Dec 02, 2016 - 17:48 |
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| koadah wrote: | Do we have to end season to join a minor?
End season every 20-30 games seems fair enough. More than that sounds like a PITA.
I am hoping the [L]eague will get much simpler options. |
Here's the thought about minors:
Every week you get a smack-brawl. They work pretty much like they do now (TV-matched Ko 2-3 rounds torunaments), except it's for teams who are in post-season.
Every month you get a minor. (And this could be a 4th option button)
Basically bigger smack-brawls. Intead of being 2-3 rounds they're 4-5 rounds?
Again, i think only teams in post-season should be allowed to enter tournaments.
The goal is give them extra money to complete their season.
Anyway, a coach could end the season of any of his team at any time. That's if he really wants them to take part in a given tournament. |
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thoralf
Joined: Mar 06, 2008
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Dec 02, 2016 - 18:31 |
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| Uedder wrote: | | Do whe have friendlies now? No. [...] Friendlies are what we call 'Ranked' and 'Box' in my eyes. |
You need to choose between "we don't have friendlies" or "we mostly play friendlies these days in R&B," U.
I think the second paraphrase describes the reality with which the season model needs to start.
| Uedder wrote: | | If what you're suggesting is having these res games count towards the end-season re-draft total games, i don't think that's a good idea. |
So you say. I don't see why. If that's a problem with the end-season re-draft total games, then the end-season re-draft total games you have in mind may be too low.
All you need is three variables to specify a season: the minimal number of games, the maximal number of games, and season duration. The question is which values these variables should to maintain or increase participation. Ignoring this question won't make it disappear.
The rulebook is agnostic regarding all these values. Appealing to the purity of the rules won't work. Appealing to the intent or the spirit or the essence of BB has no bite.
The only reliable oracle we have is the Big C.
| Uedder wrote: | | I don't get your meta-groups-leagues idea. Needs fleshing out, as of now there's nothing to think about. The boundaries are so foggy it's not even a concept. |
We already have meta-leagues. Take ARRR! It's a competition between members of a group. They play games with one another and with other B players. So it's a race.
E.L.F does about the same.
All this coheres with the model presented in DZ1, insofar as we exclude the round robin, which we don't see much for R&B. (I suppose we could have round robins for R, but I don't see how we could for B.) It makes more sense for (some) L leagues.
Is that enough to think about for you? |
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Last edited by thoralf on %b %02, %2016 - %18:%Dec; edited 1 time in total |
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mister__joshua
Joined: Jun 20, 2007
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| mrt1212 wrote: | Basically yes, but with the ability to use teams that opt in for progression seasons. Essentially create a gamefinder (and only a gamefinder) to allow coaches to play friendly exhibitions with their B and R teams while Bowlbot arranges games that count for seasons.
Holy crap, i just opined a desire to merge R and B. Brb, not feeling well. |
I quite like that idea. Also lots of coaches and teams would find it a lot easier to get games on that Gamefinder  |
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mrt1212
Joined: Feb 26, 2013
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| Posted:
Dec 02, 2016 - 18:35 |
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| thoralf wrote: |
Is that enough to think about for you? |
No. Honestly, we aren't you and inside your head understanding what groups like HPL and ARR play in making Seasons function. If anything, I get the impression that the rules just don't do anything to impose on those meta groups, not that they are somehow a silver bullet to some of the issues we have with Seasons.
Break it down for us like we're completely new to Fumbbl. If you're going to repeat something and we still don't get it, maybe its your explanation that is lacking, not our comprehension. |
Last edited by mrt1212 on %b %02, %2016 - %18:%Dec; edited 1 time in total |
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thoralf
Joined: Mar 06, 2008
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| Posted:
Dec 02, 2016 - 18:37 |
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| mrt1212 wrote: | | Break it down for us like we're completely new to Fumbbl. |
Challenge accepted.
Later. Need to go. |
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mrt1212
Joined: Feb 26, 2013
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| Posted:
Dec 02, 2016 - 18:40 |
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Also, as a matter of easing the transition, do we start counting seasons retroactively based on games already played under CRP? Or do we start fresh with no seasons accrued and coaches bump into Season turnover on their legends over time?
Might give azyx some time to figure out what to do with debog.
THIS IS KIND OF A BIG DEAL AND IMPORTANT. |
Last edited by mrt1212 on %b %02, %2016 - %20:%Dec; edited 3 times in total |
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Hero164
Joined: Jan 20, 2007
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Dec 02, 2016 - 18:40 |
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This also punishes weak players. Score fewer, cas/TD well welcome to the fact that you cant keep your best players wheras the leader can.
Secondly, a league is only a league with a ranking, neither R or B are leagues, no one wins. There is no end, so the objective is different.
Mostly though I love huge teams and big legends in fumbbl and this will mean there are just less. |
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licker
Joined: Jul 10, 2009
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| Posted:
Dec 02, 2016 - 19:03 |
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| Hero164 wrote: | This also punishes weak players. Score fewer, cas/TD well welcome to the fact that you cant keep your best players wheras the leader can.
Secondly, a league is only a league with a ranking, neither R or B are leagues, no one wins. There is no end, so the objective is different.
Mostly though I love huge teams and big legends in fumbbl and this will mean there are just less. |
Yep.
Solid points mate. Not sure anyone will care about them though  |
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Balle2000
Joined: Sep 25, 2008
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| Posted:
Dec 02, 2016 - 19:17 |
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| Purplegoo wrote: | | Are those rosters extraordinary enough to warrant HoF inclusion (2000 is beyond the norm), or are they there as examples to aim for? |
Either way they look easy to arrive at compared to what we are used to here on Fumbbl (they are padded with some coaches, cheerleaders and extra apos).
Care to elaborate your view that "2000 is beyond the norm"? |
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Purplegoo
Joined: Mar 23, 2006
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Dec 02, 2016 - 19:41 |
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A loss in translation. A hall of fame team, by definition, is extraordinary. I was asking is part of that extraordinary nature a massive TV, or are the teams there as achievable examples to aim at? In the context of the tangent the posts were a part of (what is the intended target TV of Blood Bowl in 2016, not what can we achieve on FUMBBL, although there is bound to be crossover in conversation there), it makes far more sense than the small grab there. Two or three pages ago is so passé.  |
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PainState
Joined: Apr 04, 2007
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Dec 02, 2016 - 20:55 |
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| Uedder wrote: | | Here's the thought about minors: |
Oh man, I feel I do not want to know the thoughts on majors, XFL, Smacks, Brawls and RRR are.
| Uedder wrote: | | Every week you get a smack-brawl. They work pretty much like they do now (TV-matched Ko 2-3 rounds torunaments), except it's for teams who are in post-season. |
Oh, no, here is this concept of post season VS in season again, I need to go back 2 pages to find out those definitions.
| Uedder wrote: | Every month you get a minor. (And this could be a 4th option button)
Basically bigger smack-brawls. Intead of being 2-3 rounds they're 4-5 rounds?
Again, i think only teams in post-season should be allowed to enter tournaments. |
Well, I already get this anyway, now I have to figure out this post season VS in season thing, dang it!!! where did I see that before.
| Uedder wrote: | | The goal is give them extra money to complete their season. |
Wait, hold on. Did you say more gold!! Oh, Iam in. Please tell me this is not tied into the post season VS in season part of the plan.
| Uedder wrote: | | Anyway, a coach could end the season of any of his team at any time. That's if he really wants them to take part in a given tournament. |
Ok, I had my fun and jests. 
let me be clear.
Everything just laid out will be covered if you say a team can play 25 matches, regardless of tournament play and then enter the post season phase.
If you want to enter a tournament and realize you only have 3 games before end of season you can if you choose. End your season right then and reset going into the tournament. Just like it was laid out above.
Simple, easy, no brainer.
25 match season. Each team has a new field call Seasons: it starts at 25 and goes down each time you play, when you hit 0 after that match you go into post season mode.
end your season when ever you want, getting set for a tournament that might last 5+ rounds.
if you screw up and your season ends in the middle of tournament, tough luck. Figure it out next time and watch your season match total closely. |
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PainState
Joined: Apr 04, 2007
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| Posted:
Dec 02, 2016 - 21:01 |
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You know, we have not even got to the real juicy part of all of this season stuff.
No matter what Christer decides in the end, he could throw us a curve ball and say Seasons is only League play and I will look into R/B once my headache goes away, is how long are these seasons.
That is the juicy part. The debate on how long a season means how big do we want teams to become in terms of TV.
This is really the easy part. The big debate is the TV 1400-1600 group VS the group that supports the 1900-2100 TV group.
I think I need to go get a new popcorn machine.
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Balle2000
Joined: Sep 25, 2008
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| Posted:
Dec 02, 2016 - 21:03 |
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| Purplegoo wrote: | | (what is the intended target TV of Blood Bowl in 2016, not what can we achieve on FUMBBL, although there is bound to be crossover in conversation there.) |
Yeah, I know it's retro to talk about Page 29. That's two good questions though (I'll even talk about what you had in brackets).
For the GW version the target TV, it is de facto wholly dependant on season length, so it can literally be anything. What did they intend, and was this play tested rigorously enough? Only they would know. I'll tell you were you won't find the answer though, and that's in Facebook Comments Section conjecture battles
I think the question we should ask ourselves however is - after putting all our personal agendas aside - what system can we develop so that as many Fumbblers as possible can play the kind of Blood Bowl THEY like? |
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Last edited by Balle2000 on %b %02, %2016 - %21:%Dec; edited 3 times in total |
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