FUMBBL :: Online Blood Bowl League

DanielM75

Joined: Jan 18, 2009

Posted: Sep 27, 2010 - 05:04

Hi All

There has been some talk in some recent topics about what to do with the FFB teams. Some people are saying they can stay when FFB is the official ranked division, others not.

Personally, I don't care either way, but what I would like is for it to be clarified with 100% clarity ASAP from Christer or another site admin. I beleive, from a little reading, that the intention originally was that they were test teams. However, since FFB has been going for a while, there are more games on FFB now than Ranked and it is more than just testing going on now, it is actual competitive play.

The reason I would love to know is simple. If the FFB teams aren't going to stay in the competitive division when the "testing" cycle ends, well I have played a few games with the new client so I will stick to only Ranked now. I don't want to play games with a team that will be thrown away soon whether I like it or not. Who cares if they get put in a non-ranked division, there aren't any games there anyway and I wouldn't bother played un-Ranked even if there was.

However, if the teams are going to stay, then I can play either Ranked or FFB knowing that my time spent on team development is not wasted.

P.S. I really like the new client, it is fantastic. With one exception, which I really hate! I hate having to remember at the start of a move to click pass, especially when I am thinking about having to dodge through to pickup the ball first, before I can even pass. I forgot ALL the time. Having game results decided on whether or not someone forgets to select pass at the start of their move or not, sucks.

Also, I haven't tried this, but what would happen if you forgot, but before you finish your turn you closed the client, and then reloaded? Would it have saved your current state including the non-completed action, or would it allow you to try again? If the later, then that is all the more reason to change the functionality and allow you to select pass at the end of your move.

Woodstock

Joined: Dec 11, 2004

Posted: Sep 27, 2010 - 05:17

The purpose of the FFB division right now is to test for bugs. That so many games are played at this moment, does not change the fact that the division is still in a testing phase and teams will be reset once the client is ready.
That is the latest I've heard from Christer, and the idea from the start.

DanielM75

Joined: Jan 18, 2009

Posted: Sep 27, 2010 - 05:28

Thanks mate, in that case I will stick to Ranked and hope FFB comes soon.

pythrr

Joined: Mar 07, 2006

Posted: Sep 27, 2010 - 06:37

Christer does not work for you Daniel.

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Malmir

Joined: May 20, 2008

Posted: Sep 27, 2010 - 07:31

pythrr wrote:

Christer does not work for you Daniel.

A bit harsh - I don't think he was suggesting he did or that Christer or the admins are at fault in any way. Think he just wanted an idea of future plans to avoid building up and getting attached to a team with no future.

Wreckage

Joined: Aug 15, 2004

Posted: Sep 27, 2010 - 07:42

Woodstock wrote:

The purpose of the FFB division right now is to test for bugs. That so many games are played at this moment, does not change the fact that the division is still in a testing phase and teams will be reset once the client is ready.
That is the latest I've heard from Christer, and the idea from the start.

that may be so but the ranked teams are in the new division utterly missplaced. Their skilling, their development, FF, Aporthecary, birthday teams... As I understand from conversation with an admin those teams WILL go into the competetive FFB division.I get that many people here want that so... if Christer says he does it, he does it. It will be a devastating blow into the fairness and competetiveness of the new division.
In comparison it doesn't really matter if the FFB teams are beta or not. To delete the old FFB teams and let R remain would be a failed decision of astronomic proportions.

Woodstock

Joined: Dec 11, 2004

Posted: Sep 27, 2010 - 07:49

Wreckage wrote:

Woodstock wrote:

The purpose of the FFB division right now is to test for bugs. That so many games are played at this moment, does not change the fact that the division is still in a testing phase and teams will be reset once the client is ready.
That is the latest I've heard from Christer, and the idea from the start.

that may be so but the ranked teams are in the new division utterly missplaced. Their skilling, their development, FF, Aporthecary, birthday teams... As I understand from conversation with an admin those teams WILL go into the competetive FFB division.I get that many people here want that so... if Christer says he does it, he does it. It will be a devastating blow into the fairness and competetiveness of the new division.
In comparison it doesn't really matter if the FFB teams are beta or not. To delete the old FFB teams and let R remain would be a failed decision of astronomic proportions.

Not really, but that is your opinion.

TransientNomad

Joined: May 14, 2009

Posted: Sep 27, 2010 - 08:08

Doesn’t take away from the fact people have invested a lot of time into their teams they’ll be understandable pissed if they loose them. From my own perspective it being a beta I expect the new client to crash freeze and not to get annoyed for it. It is a beta after all we are there to check for bugs. But to loose all the time I’ve put into the teams I’d be shattered. I’ve become really attached to most of then.

Woodstock

Joined: Dec 11, 2004

Posted: Sep 27, 2010 - 08:18

TransientNomad wrote:

Doesn’t take away from the fact people have invested a lot of time into their teams they’ll be understandable pissed if they loose them. From my own perspective it being a beta I expect the new client to crash freeze and not to get annoyed for it. It is a beta after all we are there to check for bugs. But to loose all the time I’ve put into the teams I’d be shattered. I’ve become really attached to most of then.

Pissed? Why?... From the start it was known that FFB was in beta, that the games played were there to test for bugs, nothing else. If people expected more, well... got to say, their own fault.

TransientNomad

Joined: May 14, 2009

Posted: Sep 27, 2010 - 08:33

Don't think people expect more. It's just natural to get attached to a team when you invest time into it. Beta or otherwise Same way people want Ranked teams to roll over they've invested time, there attached and they don't want to see that lost.

Garion

Joined: Aug 19, 2009

Posted: Sep 27, 2010 - 08:59

I originally thought it would be nice to keep them too, but really it just doesnt matter much at all, your teams will be reset, so you still get to keep the team name but it was always known that the new client is in Beta Testing and that we will most likely lose the teams.
The fact that so many games are played in this division now is good as it shows people are eager to get going with the new rule set and it also shows that it is fairly stable for the most part too. But we all knew we wouldnt be able to keep our teams hence so many teams being called just for fun and testing frogs etc...

Wreckage wrote:

That may be so but the ranked teams are in the new division utterly missplaced. Their skilling, their development, FF, Aporthecary, birthday teams... As I understand from conversation with an admin those teams WILL go into the competetive FFB division.I get that many people here want that so... if Christer says he does it, he does it. It will be a devastating blow into the fairness and competetiveness of the new division.
In comparison it doesn't really matter if the FFB teams are beta or not. To delete the old FFB teams and let R remain would be a failed decision of astronomic proportions.

Also I don't agree with this either tbh, Christer has said on numerous occasions that the new client will be as close to the new rule set as possible and the CRP includes rules for transferring teams over from older rule sets, so there is no reason this shouldn't be done. Personally I would prefer everything to be reset but really I'm not fussed, what ever happens this site will still be the best thing on the internet by a million miles.

Wreckage

Joined: Aug 15, 2004

Posted: Sep 27, 2010 - 09:07

Woodstock wrote:

Not really, but that is your opinion.

Why not? If I remember correctly Christer initially didn't intend to transfer Ranked teams either, because they were considerd untransfairable.

Now that he does... please by all means... explain it to me. Explain to me where the harm lies in letting the people keep the teams who actually like the new division.
And those who dislike it and could speculate for more then 2 years to lose their teams and not get them to the new division are the only ones interests that are worth protecting?

I'd really like to see a clean fresh start of the new division. But we don't gonna get this do we?
So please by all means tell me in what world can that make even slightly sense?

asharak

Joined: Nov 27, 2007

Posted: Sep 27, 2010 - 09:20

Given the old client is still in beta too.... you could argue the existing FFB teams arn't so different to those in Ranked! Wink

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Grod

Joined: Sep 30, 2003

Posted: Sep 27, 2010 - 09:26

I think the point is more to do with the records of the teams. The current ranked teams obtained their records in a competitive environment, while the current FFB teams did not. Moreover, many FFB teams were and are given significant advantages and disadvantages due to the developing nature of the client.

Therefore, it makes sense to not allow the current FFB teams to continue in a competitive division, but it still makes sense to allow Ranked teams to do so.

I understand this reasoning, but I would also favour allowing current FFB teams to continue, but in a future LRB5/6 non-competitive division (such as a new League or Unranked division).

Wreckage wrote:

Woodstock wrote:

Not really, but that is your opinion.

Why not? If I remember correctly Christer initially didn't intend to transfer Ranked teams either, because they were considerd untransfairable.

Now that he does... please by all means... explain it to me. Explain to me where the harm lies in letting the people keep the teams who actually like the new division.
And those who dislike it and could speculate for more then 2 years to lose their teams and not get them to the new division are the only ones interests that are worth protecting?

I'd really like to see a clean fresh start of the new division. But we don't gonna get this do we?
So please by all means tell me in what world can that make even slightly sense?

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Alibaba

Joined: Aug 18, 2003

Posted: Sep 27, 2010 - 09:31

Grod wrote:

I think the point is more to do with the records of the teams. The current ranked teams obtained their records in a competitive environment, while the current FFB teams did not. Moreover, many FFB teams were and are given significant advantages and disadvantages due to the developing nature of the client.

Therefore, it makes sense to not allow the current FFB teams to continue in a competitive division, but it still makes sense to allow Ranked teams to do so.

I understand this reasoning, but I would also favour allowing current FFB teams to continue, but in a future LRB5/6 non-competitive division (such as a new League or Unranked division).

Wreckage wrote:

Woodstock wrote:

Not really, but that is your opinion.

Why not? If I remember correctly Christer initially didn't intend to transfer Ranked teams either, because they were considerd untransfairable.

Now that he does... please by all means... explain it to me. Explain to me where the harm lies in letting the people keep the teams who actually like the new division.
And those who dislike it and could speculate for more then 2 years to lose their teams and not get them to the new division are the only ones interests that are worth protecting?

I'd really like to see a clean fresh start of the new division. But we don't gonna get this do we?
So please by all means tell me in what world can that make even slightly sense?

I agree with this.