JackassRampant
Joined: Feb 26, 2011
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Feb 11, 2014 - 17:21 |
 
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| PainState wrote: | | ... HPL … HPL ... HPL…. |
LOL in this crowd HPL* also is the initials of a certain influential 20th century author, who shall, with pun totally intended, not be named. (*Yes, that's four)
Just a reminder that, as the man said,
"The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate its contents."
Oh, and I'm totally in. Humans and Pacts and Undeads, oh my! |
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Dalfort
Joined: Jun 23, 2008
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Feb 11, 2014 - 17:34 |
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Just in case I came across as I dont like the idea, I was just outlining possible grey areas of site rules (as I see them, and I am not a site admin.) I personally love the Metagroups, love ELF, miss DMU and wish I had more skill to do anything in the Human Premier League.
Thanks for letting me clarify  |
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pythrr
Joined: Mar 07, 2006
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Feb 11, 2014 - 18:19 |
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The plucky picking pimper played pals pumping pour points. |
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JackassRampant
Joined: Feb 26, 2011
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Feb 11, 2014 - 18:55 |
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Ah, yeah, there has to be a reason not to be a particularly dirty picker.
I might note, though, that some Forlorn races are pretty damn fearsome in Ranked, because Ranked gamefinding incentivizes different teams than tournament bracketing. A 1500k Human or Undead team might not be all that awesome in a major tournament, but in Ranked play at 1500, there are some truly fearsome Human and Undead squads… fearsome, that is, if you're a 1500 team. So being incentivized to, say, fill your Forlorn grid isn't as advantageous as it sounds. Especially if there's a parallel incentive to fill your Unforlorned grid. |
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Verminardo
Joined: Sep 27, 2006
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Feb 11, 2014 - 19:12 |
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Well that's a problem that's rooted pretty deeply in the nature of Ranked, as I've noted when I tried to get matches with low TV Norse. I don't see how a Forlorn Races metagroup should help the Forlorn Race coaches around that particular problem. And if Dwarves and Orcs and CDs can get in tournament shape, Undead and Lizards should be able to do it, too.
I'm also not sure whether it really needs that much incentive, entering Forlorn Races into Majors. I didn't count them but it seems to me we get fair amounts of Lizard, Necro and Undead entries each Major, with a smattering of other Forlorns. GLT even has the Forlorn Races Qualifier, which coined the term. A meta group would still be fun, mind. It's all about the fluff and chatter and creating a little buzz. |
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RC
Joined: Sep 22, 2005
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Feb 11, 2014 - 19:35 |
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Has not CP wonn something. I thought that there was a B team that did incredible well in a tourney?
I am also very suprised that UD has not wonn anything since they where the bomb in the beginning of LRB4 with 4 wights. |
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PainState
Joined: Apr 04, 2007
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Feb 11, 2014 - 19:45 |
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I reread what you were thinking and your idea and the main problems with the initial idea are these.
| DrPoods wrote: | Hi all!
I saw some potential interest around the traps for a forlorn races metagroup and was looking for some ideas for how to go about doing this. My idea was to have a group where like-minded coaches can get together to chat about their teams, team building/match strategy for FUMBBL Majors and general stuff like skill choices. |
That is what the forums section is all about. Takling about these issues. There are many past threads covering most of the forlorn teams.
| DrPoods wrote: |
Another "plank" is to have a group member only tournament or two using the coaches' B and R teams so coaches can develop and fine tune their teams for assaults on the Major trophies!! The aim (obviously) is to try and "un"forlorn as many of these races as possible and having a controllable environment for these teams may go a long way to getting them ready as it were.
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I think this comes from that you are a new member on FUMBBL. B and R teams cannot be put into a league like you mentioned above. OPEN divison teams cannot be placed in their own tournaments like they can in the LEAGUE divison.
A Meta Group like the HPL or ELF is designed at its heart to promote those races inside the R/B universe. Its main purpose is to get more coaches to play those types of teams, introduce some diversity into the open divs.
The promotion part comes in that a few very dedicated coaches keep up with those meta groups and keep them fresh, have some form of automated scoring and so forth. They are user friendly unlike most meta groups who come and go because you have to keep score by hand and so forth, very un user friendly.
Now the HPL and ELF promote diversity in opponeets also. Which in the end makes you a better overall coach by gaining experience playing the full range of teams instead of a narrow range of teams.
Which I might add is one of the problems with R/B is that once you get to a certain TV level the number of team type declines very very fast and you find you play the same 5-7 races all the time but that is a diffrent issue.
So lets say we create this utopian meta group of forlorn teams.
1)You would need some type of Auto score script.
2)A dedicated comish for this meta group to get it on its feet.
3)Come up with shiny baubles and so forth to reward the top forlorn teams. A nice group page is a must.
4)invest a lot of time and hope your fellow coaches feel this a fun and competitive meta group.
5)Be prepared that in about 2 months no one will care about this meta group and it will die. 99% of meta groups DIE!!!! It is a 2 month love affair and then everybody moves on. |
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Hitonagashi
Joined: Apr 09, 2006
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Feb 11, 2014 - 20:02 |
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| RC wrote: | Has not CP wonn something. I thought that there was a B team that did incredible well in a tourney?
I am also very suprised that UD has not wonn anything since they where the bomb in the beginning of LRB4 with 4 wights. |
It was the FC RandomOracle won. He beat them in the final. |
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Verminardo
Joined: Sep 27, 2006
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Feb 11, 2014 - 20:03 |
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| RC wrote: | Has not CP wonn something. I thought that there was a B team that did incredible well in a tourney?
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They reached the final in the Fumbbl Cup but were beaten by Chuck.
Edit: Ninja'd by Hito. |
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PainState
Joined: Apr 04, 2007
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Feb 11, 2014 - 20:17 |
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The interesting thing about that run by that CP teams was this.
They get taken down by the team of destiny in the finals.
Beat the the front runner CD out of Ranked in the Semi
Beat one of the best Humans teams to make a run in a major in the Qt. finals
And in the round of 16 they beat a Ogre team.
It was a very interesting run by them in the FC but it came up one short. Mainly because CP are forlorn and could not win back to back against CD and Chaos. |
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PainState
Joined: Apr 04, 2007
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Feb 11, 2014 - 20:24 |
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So the lesson of this golden run? IMO it is this.
Forlorn teams in majors have to be able to win Back to Back to Back to Back matches against a combo of...Chaos, CD, DE's. WE's Dorfs and Nurg. Not to mention that match against tier 2 teams that are skilled to beat your forlorn team
That is a very tall order for a forlorn team because they are not equiped on the roster to handle that.
There needs to be an outside factor like LUCK to give them an edge. This luck can come in the form of the Draw of the tournament, luck in game or even luck that your opponeet was mauled in his previous match. Something has to "turn" for forlorn teams to make a long, extended run of wins in a row to win a major.
Which is why the "top" coaches avoid playing forlorn teams like the plague...to many variables that hinge outside their control. |
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Pentalarc
Joined: Mar 17, 2012
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Feb 11, 2014 - 20:27 |
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I say do something like E.L.F., and open it to all teams. |
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Verminardo
Joined: Sep 27, 2006
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Feb 11, 2014 - 21:13 |
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| PainState wrote: | | Which is why the "top" coaches avoid playing forlorn teams like the plague...to many variables that hinge outside their control. |
Is that so? Tarabaralla made a deep run with Vampires once. Happygrue used to enter Slann all the time and even sometimes went deep. We have several very good coaches who bring Undead or Necros more or less frequently, maybe not the absolute top coaches in terms of Majors performance but there might be a connection, no? And of course we have several notorious Human and Lizardman coaches who would count among the top coaches if they played tier 1 teams.
But maybe that's what you meant: If you are a very good player but don't focus on tier 1 teams, you will not become a frequent top performer in Majors. That is certainly true and it is as it should be.
On the other hand, we've seen very good coaches with tier 1 teams go out first round, time and again, so... |
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JackassRampant
Joined: Feb 26, 2011
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Feb 11, 2014 - 21:20 |
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FUMBBL Unforlorners Society of Stubborn Coaches (FUSSCo)
Any Forlorn B or R team
All scoring done team-by-team over 2-month season:
3 points for each Unforlorned team race beaten
2 points for each Forlorn team race beaten
X points for a longest unbeaten streak of X games
Y points for a longest winning streak of Y games |
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D_Arquebus
Joined: Aug 02, 2003
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Feb 11, 2014 - 23:27 |
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OK,
Noobish question here: The Majors (at least in Ranked) take > 150/160TV up to the Sky's the Limit?
SO you'd be looking at min 180-200TV for these buffed teams to make a go of it?
Cheers |
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