ph0enyx13
Joined: Nov 14, 2015
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 Posted:
Jul 12, 2016 - 06:29 |
 
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I think I know how to skill them just fine, but what is the best resource for information or to learn how to use undead on the field? I've been having issues stopping people on defense and a little bit in terms of running 2-3 turn offensive drives. I am also kind of worried about playing av9 teams because typically my undead strategy revolves around the mummies generating KOs and cas. |
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JimmyFantastic
Joined: Feb 06, 2007
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Jul 12, 2016 - 08:05 |
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I'm making a Youtube playlist of my Undead Beta team on BB2 - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPCKLFRRyI4&list=PLF7TYdtPEaNTkZd_q0lHLVjVIXiVQ9U_-&index=1
You should be able to pick some stuff up from that, though most games will be mirrors 
Mostly it's about your Mummies getting in the right places tying up 2 players and not getting stranded, stranding oppo's good mens on your Zombies, and protecting your Ghouls while using them like a pack of stronger but less mobile Skinks. |
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Pull down the veil - actively bad for the hobby! |
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ArrestedDevelopment
Joined: Sep 14, 2015
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Jul 12, 2016 - 11:23 |
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Standard, canned: | everyone, ever in every L2P thread wrote: | | Watch Endzone's replays |
But in general, I would say you can learn a lot about positioning undead properly by spec'ing NAF tourney games on here, or checking replays of successful undead teams used in them. |
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Loew
Joined: Feb 02, 2005
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Jul 12, 2016 - 15:33 |
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zakatan
Joined: May 17, 2008
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Jul 12, 2016 - 16:27 |
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zombies are your best resource |
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licker
Joined: Jul 10, 2009
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Jul 12, 2016 - 19:29 |
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| ph0enyx13 wrote: | | I think I know how to skill them just fine, but what is the best resource for information or to learn how to use undead on the field? I've been having issues stopping people on defense and a little bit in terms of running 2-3 turn offensive drives. I am also kind of worried about playing av9 teams because typically my undead strategy revolves around the mummies generating KOs and cas. |
Here's my short guide.
Play with 13 or 14 and foul as much as you possibly can.
Ok, more specifically to your questions.
How you play defense depends on what you are facing, but generally you want to use your Mummies to tie up multiple opponents, or at least create blocked off zones where the opponent cannot easily penetrate so that you can use the rest of your team more effectively.
Nominally you want to always mark them, no matter what they are (yeah even cpomb to a degree) with your zombie/skele fodders and force them to throw blocks which keeps them from being able to reposition. Works best if you force them to move another player for the assist, so your zombie taking one block 'disabled' two opponent players.
Depending on how you skill your Wights and Ghouls you need to keep them out of contact as they are your mobile reaction ability, and you usually only have around 4 of them available. Ghouls are fast enough to be able to reposition well against most teams, but they are also fragile, though you shouldn't let that scare you when you need to use them.
Undead are not terrible at 2 or 3 turning compared to MA6 teams. But certainly it's difficult as you don't have MA6 players to help screen them down field. AG3 is AG3, sure you don't have pass or catch, but so long as you saved a reroll for your attempt you aren't that bad off depending on what your opponent has left.
The thing I see often from any team though on 2 and 3 turn drives is that they still try to maximize LOS blocks rather than setting up to allow more coverage down field. Now your Mummies probably are not going to be helping down field, so blocking with them is usually correct (but on 2ds without block you better think it through very carefully). However setting up that 3rd los block isn't always the best idea. You may want to leave your players away from the opponents LOS so that they can at least form a back guard for your advanced ghouls/wights.
Now when you say 'afraid to play AV9' I assume you're really only talking about Orcs and Dwarfs. And in some ways those are not favorable matchups for undead, however you're not that disadvantaged either. If you have the bench, and if you have a handful of DP zombies, you counter their AV9 by fouling them. Your ghouls are also faster and more 'mobile' (with dodge and A access) than anything they have, so you will need to try to use that to your advantage. Your Mummies are also really good at tying up the opposition as they cannot dodge out efficiently. Though with enough guard they can start knocking your Mummies down. |
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ph0enyx13
Joined: Nov 14, 2015
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Jul 14, 2016 - 13:12 |
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Those tend to be short and kinda limited. Like if they were all written as well as the wood elves that would be great, but some are better quality than others |
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licker
Joined: Jul 10, 2009
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Jul 14, 2016 - 17:24 |
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So maybe you should look at this in a different way.
Certainly Undead have roster traits that other rosters don't have, yet they still play mainly as a bash/attrition team. Reading tactics guides or looking at how those kinds of team generally play will give you more insight into how you can approach playing Undead generally.
For example, Undead are not that different from Orcs in how they might try to play the positional game. Mummies are not BoBs, but they fill similar roles, the Mummy is better, but there are more BoBs. Wights and Blitzers are the same player exactly (regen vs. AV9), other than you have 4 blitzers and 2 Wights. Zombies/skeles are basically the same as line orcs in that their purpose is largely to take hits and stand next to things to tie them down.
Now Ghouls are the only wild card really, but they offer you a bit more mobility than an orc team at the cost of being more fragile (though they do blodge up so quickly that helps a bit). Largely that makes your offense a bit better, but your defense potentially a bit worse, though so long as the ghouls don't take armor breaks they will help you recover position better than orcs could. |
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ph0enyx13
Joined: Nov 14, 2015
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Jul 15, 2016 - 04:53 |
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| licker wrote: | So maybe you should look at this in a different way.
Certainly Undead have roster traits that other rosters don't have, yet they still play mainly as a bash/attrition team. Reading tactics guides or looking at how those kinds of team generally play will give you more insight into how you can approach playing Undead generally.
For example, Undead are not that different from Orcs in how they might try to play the positional game. Mummies are not BoBs, but they fill similar roles, the Mummy is better, but there are more BoBs. Wights and Blitzers are the same player exactly (regen vs. AV9), other than you have 4 blitzers and 2 Wights. Zombies/skeles are basically the same as line orcs in that their purpose is largely to take hits and stand next to things to tie them down.
Now Ghouls are the only wild card really, but they offer you a bit more mobility than an orc team at the cost of being more fragile (though they do blodge up so quickly that helps a bit). Largely that makes your offense a bit better, but your defense potentially a bit worse, though so long as the ghouls don't take armor breaks they will help you recover position better than orcs could. |
Undead is my first bash team though, I've really only mostly played Undead and Humans, well chaos in BB2 but I was awful with them. It does sound like good advice though. My main tactic is either bleed them dry of players, or bleed them dry of rerolls and then use the speed of the ghouls for break aways |
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mrt1212
Joined: Feb 26, 2013
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Jul 15, 2016 - 05:24 |
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The essence winning the game is in how you do that better than your opponent 
Unfortunately team building is a lot easier to get right than positioning otherwise we'd have threads like "How this arrangement of 2 guard players in relation to one another subverts most opponent actions". Also the reluctance to pass on specific good knowledge in a competitive game has to be considered. |
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licker
Joined: Jul 10, 2009
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Jul 15, 2016 - 16:31 |
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| mrt1212 wrote: | The essence winning the game is in how you do that better than your opponent
Unfortunately team building is a lot easier to get right than positioning otherwise we'd have threads like "How this arrangement of 2 guard players in relation to one another subverts most opponent actions". Also the reluctance to pass on specific good knowledge in a competitive game has to be considered. |
I haven't found too much reluctance to pass on knowledge, especially here at FUMBBL. I think it's analogous to chess at least, where there is an astounding amount of knowledge captured and made available to everyone, but it doesn't really help everyone to the same degree.
There is always that innate ability a player must have to actually put the knowledge to good use once the game starts.
Especially if you are playing tournaments or (some) leagues. The pressure is different from 'just another R or B game', and I've seen very strange looking plays from very strange looking players.
Wait, that didn't come out quite right... |
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