harvestmouse
Joined: May 13, 2007
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 Posted:
May 17, 2015 - 00:21 |
 
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| Purplegoo wrote: |
In all seriousness though, why jab at the guy? He can play Blood Bowl as he chooses. Lots of people get lots of wins in similar ways, and it's not a nefarious way of operating. |
Yeah it was cheap, and I had been drinking. I generally shouldn't and don't want to get involved.
However if everybody played like this; the game would be in a terrible state. I think a lot of you need to wake up and smell the coffee as to the state of the perpetual game thanks to TV and how to be regimental in your approach to TV.
With such win records what percentage of games are won before even setting up on the field (bar a horrific dicing)? I'd wager well over 60%.
There's no way you'll get a regular supply of new players willing to stick at the game in an environment like that. |
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Grod
Joined: Sep 30, 2003
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| Posted:
May 17, 2015 - 05:43 |
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| MattDakka wrote: | | Since CR is meaningless Christer should remove it, so people will stop caring about it. |
If you find it meaningless, why do you care either way?
Anyway back to OP - humans are quite fast. That is about all they have going for them. Of the three teams Nurgle, Khemri and Chaos, your speed advantage can win out against the first two races - they are rather slow on average. If you can get them to overcommit their defence in 1 part of the field, you should find a gap.
Chaos is a bit tougher. They have decent speed and St4 bitzes everywhere. They do tend to suffer from lack of rerolls and skills. My advice here is to go after the ball aggressively, don't defend passively and trade blitzes. If your chaos opponent is of the mindset to kill at all costs, you may get your team crippled, but you should score enough to win. If your chaos coach wants to win, by going after the ball you force him to actually play blood bowl and the game gets more interesting. Ideally you need to keep an eye on rerolls, both his and yours. Try to force him into critical rolls to expend rerolls (e.g. marking ball carrier etc). If you can get his rerolls down to zero, up the aggression factor and hope for the best! |
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Arktoris
Joined: Feb 16, 2004
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| Posted:
May 17, 2015 - 07:29 |
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CR should stay. I like having over 160 or under 150. When I'm over 160 I feel like "whoo hoo" \o/
and when I'm under 150, people are so friendly offering games.
when I'm in the 150 zone I'm like  meh |
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Balle2000
Joined: Sep 25, 2008
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| Posted:
May 17, 2015 - 07:35 |
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| Grod wrote: | | MattDakka wrote: | | Since CR is meaningless Christer should remove it, so people will stop caring about it. |
If you find it meaningless, why do you care either way? |
The below is off topic:
You could argue that CR provides an incentive for coaches to seek the most CR boosting roster strategies, while at the same time discouraging challenging rosters or alternative less successful, fluffy roster builds.
When the "CR vanity" drives coaches towards power gaming exploits like minmax and killstack it becomes especially unfortunate and it affects the community negatively.
Mind, I'm not saying CR is the only reason for power gaming 
To make the CR a lot less prominent part of Fumbbl, or remove it altogether could be a positive improvement for the Fumbbl community in my opinion. |
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Grod
Joined: Sep 30, 2003
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| Posted:
May 17, 2015 - 07:43 |
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Do you mean CRP causes coaches to play competitively and care about whether they win or lose rather than just having fun? |
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Balle2000
Joined: Sep 25, 2008
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| Posted:
May 17, 2015 - 08:02 |
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| Grod wrote: | | Do you mean CRP causes coaches to play competitively and care about whether they win or lose rather than just having fun? |
Assuming we are talking about Coach Ranking (CR), I'm saying it provides the incentive for coaches to boost their CR and achieving that "Legend" tag.
This is not bad in itself. However, when it leads coaches to exploitative roster builds because other builds fail them, it affects the community negatively in two ways.
The first one, which is not really a big issue, is that some coaches will have an artificially boosted CR from playing mostly "easy mode" builds.
The second one, which might be a problem, is that the power gaming more often than not provides a negative playing experience for the other players.
So I think making CR less prominent might mellow out the playing field a bit.
Note: I don't play Ranked so my views are based on my experience from Box.
Anyway, for the topic:
Developing a one-turner which you keep on the bench might be a good strategy. Starting the second half with 1-1, or doing a T16 2-1. If you still got players left. |
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bghandras
Joined: Feb 06, 2011
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| Posted:
May 17, 2015 - 08:37 |
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Further random thoughts
1. Don't mind CR. I would make the same decisions no matter of CR. My drive is to perfect my playbook with the race I am working with.
2. If anybody interested, then I am glad to share my findings. There is no secret. I don't mind if you use my strategy against me, on the contrary. That gives me further chance to improve my game.
3. You are more than welcome to optimize your roster in order to beat me. Challenge is actually appreciated.
Sarcastic mode on: If somebody is offended by high level of play, then shall I be offended when somebody activates tier3 teams in the box? Sarcastic mode off. (Hint: I am not, but I would prefer games against tier1 races in the box.) |
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mrt1212
Joined: Feb 26, 2013
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| Posted:
May 17, 2015 - 09:16 |
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| bghandras wrote: |
2. If anybody interested, then I am glad to share my findings. There is no secret. I don't mind if you use my strategy against me, on the contrary. That gives me further chance to improve my game.
3. You are more than welcome to optimize your roster in order to beat me. Challenge is actually appreciated.
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This is the reason for playing at a certain point. Always trying to make the best decision at the right time and hopefully the dice bear out the process. If not, see what else could have worked and maybe try it next time. |
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JimmyFantastic
Joined: Feb 06, 2007
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| Posted:
May 17, 2015 - 11:28 |
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Grod has it right; balls to the wall and hope for the best. |
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koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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| Posted:
May 17, 2015 - 11:29 |
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| harvestmouse wrote: |
However if everybody played like this; the game would be in a terrible state. |
Well, they don't. Zons are one the least played teams. If more people played zons more would take tackle and use dwarves & CDs.
| harvestmouse wrote: |
I think a lot of you need to wake up and smell the coffee as to the state of the perpetual game thanks to TV and how to be regimental in your approach to TV. |
Play to the environment that you are in. If you don't like it play in a different environment.
| harvestmouse wrote: |
With such win records what percentage of games are won before even setting up on the field (bar a horrific dicing)? I'd wager well over 60%.
There's no way you'll get a regular supply of new players willing to stick at the game in an environment like that. |
They are encouraged to not start in that environment. Though I suppose getting continually picked in Ranked could be worse.
Big shout to Christer for expanding open leagues back 40 teams from 26! \o/
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koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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| Posted:
May 17, 2015 - 11:34 |
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| Balle2000 wrote: |
So I think making CR less prominent might mellow out the playing field a bit. |
If may also lead to fewer games being played overall.
Having something to play for encourages some people to play a game here rather than just doing something else.
Is there any point having 'competitive' divisions where people are discouraged from being competitive? |
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harvestmouse
Joined: May 13, 2007
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| Posted:
May 17, 2015 - 12:12 |
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| bghandras wrote: | Challenge is actually appreciated.
(Hint: I am not, but I would prefer games against tier1 races in the box.) |
I was happy to let it go; as yes, I was being an asshole. However come on, now you're insulting my and their intelligence now.
I'm not saying you're an ass and won't help players, nor a nasty person....... but challenge is welcome? That's just crap.
If challenge is welcome, why don't you play outside of your comfort zone? If challenge is welcome, why do You play a set number of powerful races in both competitive divisions at a sweet spotted set TV?
If challenge is welcome, why don't you play super star or legend coaches regularly or even semi regularly or even ever outside of competitions in ranked?
If you are so fixated on tier 1 teams, why don't you just play against tier 1 teams? You don't seem to be so fixated about playing against them in ranked.
You know TV, you know the site and you know match making very well and are using those to your advantage. You sir are a winaholic. You're win rate is far too high for your games to be competitive. I was once a winaholic too, (no where near as good at it as you mind) let go.....nobody gives a crap.
A banana is a banana not a bent apple. |
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bghandras
Joined: Feb 06, 2011
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| Posted:
May 17, 2015 - 12:27 |
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@harvestmouse
1. I have little interest at this point about races beyond Tier1. Ideally I would play Tier1 races against Tier1 races all day, but this is not the way life works.
2. So I am interested in a challenge BETWEEN tier1 races. I am not interested in a challenge like playing flings. Why? I simply want to figure out the most competitive part of the playbooks. I have limited time, and this is the highest priority. Maybe in 5 years, who knows. But at this point I am looking for tactics at the top of the meta.
3. I was referring to blackbox all the time, not ranked. You made a point about ranked, which was not related in my mind, and I did not refer to it. You might be right at criticizing my ranked behaviour, but that is not the point of this discussion.
With that said you are entitled to your opinion. What I wanted to make clear with the sarcasm is that different people are interested in different aspect of the game. Looks like this point was amiss, and instead you took a personal spin.
I want to make it absolutely clear what is my expectation, and what I mean by challenge. I hope that is not an insult to make a point. (Even if you don't agree with the target.) |
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JimmyFantastic
Joined: Feb 06, 2007
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| Posted:
May 17, 2015 - 12:32 |
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| harvestmouse wrote: | | let go.....nobody gives a crap. |
Words to live by, especially for you. |
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Balle2000
Joined: Sep 25, 2008
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| Posted:
May 17, 2015 - 12:58 |
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| koadah wrote: | | Balle2000 wrote: | | So I think making CR less prominent might mellow out the playing field a bit. |
If may also lead to fewer games being played overall.
Having something to play for encourages some people to play a game here rather than just doing something else.
Is there any point having 'competitive' divisions where people are discouraged from being competitive? |
Encouraging more play is a good, valid point I reckon. Although I'm not sure they trump the exploit incentive one.
But you are turning it completely on its head when you say "discouraged from being competitive". Trying to remove an incentive for power gaming - which the current over-simplified ranking system does - isn't nearly the same as discouraging from being competitive.
Anyway, a reworked CR/ladder system which wasn't so open to abuse is something we might benefit from. Making the rating a composite of several different races, on not able to climb by only using one race, could be an idea.
Or rename CR. To something like Win-Streak-Rating or Power-Play-Rating  |
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