Laggo
Joined: Dec 28, 2011
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 Posted:
Jan 01, 2012 - 04:24 |
 
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Hi,
I'm pretty new to fumbbl but I noticed the stat tracking or game analysis features are kind of lacking.
The game overview's don't tell you very much and the only long term stats you get are (afaik) mostly to do with your coach rating development.
I happen to be a programmer irl and I think there are some things that could be done third party to alleviate this if the interest was there.
I've played around with pulling the game text log from the window and running analysis through that but since the log doesn't record coordinates (could this be updated?!?) the only stats pullable are pretty generic
Passes completed/intercepted, dodges failed/suceeded, pow/pushback numbers and the like
With coordinates you can get a bit more specific like
drives succeeded down middle/left/right of pitch
avg players near ball during turnover
etc.
I don't think it's impossible at first glance to track/plot positions third party but its easily more annoying.
I think what I'm getting at is whether or not there is interest in this kind of project, and whether or not people would be willing to download a third party application to track/display this kind of stuff. |
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Bobs
Joined: Feb 26, 2009
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Jan 01, 2012 - 06:10 |
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| Laggo wrote: |
I happen to be a programmer irl and I think there are some things that could be done third party to alleviate this if the interest was there.
I think what I'm getting at is whether or not there is interest in this kind of project, and whether or not people would be willing to download a third party application to track/display this kind of stuff. |
I'd say if your interested just do it and plenty of others would happily use the program.
Lots of stat junkies around here. |
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si non modo numquam pragmaticam
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Laggo
Joined: Dec 28, 2011
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Jan 01, 2012 - 07:17 |
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This is what i was thinking, and I just don't see very much value in Passes Completed / Passes Failed.
Tracking players on the other hand... This creates interesting stats but is much harder to do (at the moment I'm not even sure what would be the best way) and I've had these kind of applications before end up with 7 dl's because somebody declared it had some bizzarro virus |
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koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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Jan 01, 2012 - 08:58 |
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pythrr
Joined: Mar 07, 2006
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Jan 01, 2012 - 12:17 |
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0/1/13 is all the stat I need. 
seriously though, have fun and go stat-happy |
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Woodstock
Joined: Dec 11, 2004
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Jan 01, 2012 - 13:49 |
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Problem is that too few people care about this stuff to justify spending time on it for those that code it. As long as the client is not complete and bug free, don't get your hopes up on getting more stats out of the game then in the current version. |
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opusthefowl
Joined: May 28, 2007
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Jan 01, 2012 - 16:53 |
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I wish you luck Laggo.
In the league I am in, I am the unofficial stats guy and also wish there was more depth in this area. But posts pointing out the demand vs effort issues are bang-on.
I personally would like to see every action result recorded and made accessible such as dodges, GFI and vampire feedings. BUT, it's a heck of a lot of work and I know fewer are interested than are not interested in this "depth".
So, all I can say is that I wish you luck...
If you do put something out one day, I'll be there to try it! |
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Laggo
Joined: Dec 28, 2011
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Jan 01, 2012 - 21:48 |
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To be honest I'm not sure why the game text log (and game xml output) doesn't record coordinates.
Snotling started a move action
or
Lineman started a blitz action
should be
Snotling started a move action.
Snotling ended at (13,3)
and
(diceroll)
Lineman follows up the block. Lineman ended at (12,2).
and really the game log should be appended to the xml output for the match result anyway. Right now I guess the game log gets abandoned right after the game ends (lol). Well I guess it's preserved in the replay file so it exists somewhere...
I guess at this point I will try suggesting that in some form and seeing what comes.
At best with those xml outputs I could get something going where you entered your team id and it setup a neat little graphic/template for your team with those stats (I guess comparing the avg's against your coach avg's to have more data). |
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Woodstock
Joined: Dec 11, 2004
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Jan 01, 2012 - 21:56 |
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I think your expectations are far too high... The client is made by a few people in their free time. Not a dedicated group that spends 8 hours a day, 5 days a week on it...
We would all be happy if the client is completely functional and bug free, statistics are just extras most of us don't care about. |
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Laggo
Joined: Dec 28, 2011
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Jan 01, 2012 - 22:12 |
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Oh no I get that for sure, but there is a difference between programming a new ruleset option and printing another line of text in the existing log that calls the playername and playerx playery variables once a move/blitz/foul/pass/whatever action is completed and the player is now unavailable.
Then appending the log to the xml output (don't even have to format it into its own tags, just tag the whole damn thing as the gamelog) shouldn't be hard either.
Of course, this is all assuming the classes/methods that make up the client make sense and make the data easy to pull (which I assume because we're talking about basic information the client is accessing all the time anyway) and not spaghetti.
And I have no idea what the developer situation is or has been like, but perhaps the FFB team should think of turning it into an open-source project? Then people with the skills could look into these kind of small fixes / updates themselves and get it cleared afterwards. |
Last edited by Laggo on %b %01, %2012 - %22:%Jan; edited 1 time in total |
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Woodstock
Joined: Dec 11, 2004
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Jan 01, 2012 - 22:14 |
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Yeah... you dont get it... |
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Laggo
Joined: Dec 28, 2011
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Jan 01, 2012 - 22:16 |
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So the client is spaghetti or by a few people in their free time you mean they don't exist anymore.
In either case, people should be really talking open-source at this point then. |
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pythrr
Joined: Mar 07, 2006
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Jan 01, 2012 - 23:07 |
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There are well established reasons why the developers did not want to go open source, which are detailed in a number of fourm threads (try searching). AFAIK these reasons still apply. |
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Laggo
Joined: Dec 28, 2011
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Jan 01, 2012 - 23:35 |
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So I searched that thread and this was the answer provided
| Kalimar wrote: | | Ok, here is why I do not plan to make FFB open source at this point: it would quite simply kill my fun. |
Literally that thread is basically full of people pointing out the upsides to open-sourcing this kind of project and the lead developer chimes in with "No because then I don't get to be in charge and maybe I'll have to comment some stuff".
Appreciate all the work this Kalimar has done and I've had a ton of fun using his client so far, and the last thing I wanted was for this thread to get hostile or somehow demanding but...
lol
"well established reasons" is pushing it a tad.
In any case, you can rev. eng most of the client side java so maybe if I get really bored over the next few months (assuming nothing comes from this thread or the one in the client forum) I will work on trying to pull player coords from a live game and see what comes.
But yeah, I agree that stats are fluff. |
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pythrr
Joined: Mar 07, 2006
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Jan 01, 2012 - 23:41 |
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And fair enough too. Kalimar put in the 1000s of hours to make the client (along with help from his friends).
IMHO this gives him the right to do as he pleases. |
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