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Zabriskie69



Joined: Oct 18, 2016

Post   Posted: Aug 25, 2017 - 09:51 Reply with quote Back to top

With the new rules , the Tournament Weight should include the treasury cause it's a real advantage to have a lot of money . Your opinion ?
El_Dude



Joined: Jan 18, 2013

Post   Posted: Aug 25, 2017 - 11:39 Reply with quote Back to top

I think it's definitely worth considering. The value of the treasury is much higher since the inducement rules were changed, and we don't have seasons to balance this and give teams an extra reason to save their money.
Jim_Fear



Joined: May 02, 2014

Post   Posted: Aug 25, 2017 - 18:38 Reply with quote Back to top

This from the coaches who brought Amazons and Undead, respectively, to a 1300TW Minor.

Lame

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JackassRampant



Joined: Feb 26, 2011

Post   Posted: Aug 25, 2017 - 18:45 Reply with quote Back to top

I think treasury in excess of like 100k should be considered for TW.

But it's really hard to game this beyond the first match of any given tournament. You can build up to about 200k-290k, I guess.

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What is Nuffle's tree? Risk its trunk, space the branches. Touchdowns are its fruit.
What is Nuffle's lawn? Inches, squares, and Tackle Zones; reddened blades of grass.
Zabriskie69



Joined: Oct 18, 2016

Post   Posted: Aug 25, 2017 - 19:41 Reply with quote Back to top

Jim_Fear wrote:
This from the coaches who brought Amazons and Undead, respectively, to a 1300TW Minor.

Lame

What is your thought beyond this agressive post ?
ArrestedDevelopment



Joined: Sep 14, 2015

Post   Posted: Aug 25, 2017 - 20:43 Reply with quote Back to top

JackassRampant wrote:
I think treasury in excess of like 100k should be considered for TW.


Possibly, but as you say:

JackassRampant wrote:
But it's really hard to game this beyond the first match of any given tournament. You can build up to about 200k-290k, I guess.


200-290k is where I attempt run most of my teams (EM roll willing). I don't tend to spend on inducements, and recycle/replace players as preference.

While accounting for treasury in TW might lessen the chances of someone entering a ~1300 team in a minor with 700k treasury, it also might limit the numbers/races of entrants from coaches who wish to run an avg. 200k+ treasury on (some of) their teams.


The next issue is that given inducements are not equal to player skills etc of an equivalent value, where do you set the barometer?

Another thing to consider is also how this would affect teams entering the tournament with treasury - with the added knowledge that inducements are additive.

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El_Dude



Joined: Jan 18, 2013

Post   Posted: Aug 25, 2017 - 22:25 Reply with quote Back to top

Jim_Fear wrote:
This from the coaches who brought Amazons and Undead, respectively, to a 1300TW Minor.

Lame


Goodness. If there's a cogent point in here I'm struggling to find it.
Jim_Fear



Joined: May 02, 2014

Post   Posted: Aug 25, 2017 - 22:28 Reply with quote Back to top

What ARE my thoughts, Zabriskie? Well, I'm glad you asked...

Having 100,000 (100K) in your treasury is doable these days, providing you do not roll a 1 on the Expensive Mistakes (EM) roll, post-match. It is even likely that a team may accumulate 200,000 (200K) if they are lucky with their EM rolls. Holding on to a treasury above 200K is difficult, based upon these same die rolls. Depending upon the team’s race, many coaches prefer to keep treasury in the treasury in cause they lose a positional during a match, rather than spend it on 200k worth of inducements.

We’ll use the 1300TW Minor as an example

BattleLore(that filthy lucker) has an orc team with 170K in their treasury. He won the first round match, and now has 260K in treasury. He has yet to ready his team and face the EM roll which will likely reduce his treasury greatly. From here he can do a handful of things:


    Buy additional players – Giving himself a numbers advantage at the cost of handing over free inducements to his opponents
    Hire and Fire additional Staff – Reducing his treasury to a level less likely to be ravaged by EM
    Roll for EM and hope for the best – If he rolls a 6, that’s a lot of potential free inducement for the next round of the tournament


With the first option, it could pay off, or it could blow up in his face, depending on all of the variables we Blood Bowl players are used to having to calculate (race/# of players/inducements/our rolls/their rolls). That being stated, I’m really not that frightened by an additional three skill-less linemen on the roster, unless you have a team which “sweet spots” at low TV, but also suffers from low AV, therefore being prone to receive fouls (looking at you, Z).

The second option, the safest of the three, probably leaves BattleLore with 120k in treasury, of which he’s probably only be willing to spend 50K of in match on inducements, just in case he loses a blitzer on a freak failed GFI.

The third option, the one most people seem to be frightened of, has the greatest potential to change the outcome of his following match. That stated, if BattleLore manages to roll a 6 on EM, and then win his second round match, roll another 6 on EM, beat his third round opponent, and then roll one more 6 on EM before the final of the tournament, he’s earned the right to spend all of his treasury on inducements for the final as he sees fit, or any match in-between.

Accept that Blood Bowl is not “fair”, and that 90% of the game is based upon random die rolls. If someone’s “luck” is better than yours, spite foul their best players.
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