14 coaches online • Server time: 05:09
Index Search Usergroups Profile
Log in
Recent Forum Topics goto Post Blackbox Trophy Seas...goto Post CBFL - grey cup #2goto Post Dornbirn World Cup -...
SearchSearch 
Post new topic   Reply to topic
View previous topic Log in to check your private messages View next topic
Poll
What direction should the E.L.F. take?
Go back to the way it used to be.
19%
 19%  [ 13 ]
Stay the course. Everything is just fine!
19%
 19%  [ 13 ]
Badges, you say... are they shiny?
28%
 28%  [ 19 ]
Will you listen to me for a change!!!
7%
 7%  [ 5 ]
The ELF is dead man. Just let it go already.
24%
 24%  [ 16 ]
Total Votes : 66


Tathar



Joined: Sep 29, 2006

Post   Posted: Feb 27, 2009 - 18:02 Reply with quote Back to top

Kinks wrote:
babelfilm wrote:
Interesting concept.

A competition of who can challenge the team that out class yours the most....

Not sure if that is for me. But we will see...


I'm happy with points been awarded for "attendence", but I don't feel anymore points should be awarded for playing and losing to a stronger team / opponent than a weak team / opponent.

I think a modifier would be better than straight points. So something like:

CR 150 < 155 & -4/+4 TS = x1
CR 155 < 160 & -4/+4 TS = x1.5
CR 155 < 160 & +5/+9 TS = x2

Obviously the modifier would be applied to all points gained (win bonus, TDs, Cas, etc)

You get the idea (not going to draw our an entire example table)


If you want to get away from bandings then the modifier could be calculated like:

(TS/100 + CR/150) ^ 2

I used the square to emphasize the modifier for different TS and CR combinations. But you could alter it to produce whatever scale of gradings you wanted.

My formula in Excel was like: =ROUND(POWER(("TS"/100)+("CR"/150),2),2)

Code:

CR    TS    Mod
      
150    5   1.10
150   10   1.21
150   20   1.44
150   40   1.96
160    5   1.25
160   10   1.36
160   20   1.60
160   40   2.15
170    5   1.40
170   10   1.52
170   20   1.78
170   40   2.35
180    5   1.56
180   10   1.69
180   20   1.96
180   40   2.56


Last edited by Tathar on Feb 27, 2009 - 18:03; edited 1 time in total
pizzamogul



Joined: Jun 13, 2005

Post   Posted: Feb 27, 2009 - 18:03 Reply with quote Back to top

I'm thinking more along the lines of having the baseline (win, tie, loss points) and then offering a few bonus points based on both the team match up and coaching match up. For example:

TS within an acceptable range = 1 point
CR within an acceptable range = 1 point
Opposing team is "famous" (played >100 matches) = 1 point
Opposing coach has a legendary award (fouler, scorer, whatever) = 1 point
(Parameters can be different - these are just ideas) Etc...

Encourage coaches to look for matches that would make great games to spectate. As such, the league winner might have only 1 or 2 points more than the 2nd place and 3rd place teams - and anyone could really have a shot at winning if they want to play the "right" matches. Might result in frequent co and tri-champion scenarios, but I can live with that if the journey is enjoyable!

I'm wanting to avoid the "need a calculator" scoring and I also don't want this to be the "Association of Suicidal Matchups." I'm looking for a league that has achievable goals and is above-all-else fun to play!

Thanks for all the ideas and suggestions. Keep them coming! I'm willing to take some time to get any potential "upheaval" done right. Thank you for your patience!

_________________
"Don't expect mercy."
-Woodstock


Last edited by pizzamogul on Feb 27, 2009 - 18:06; edited 1 time in total
pizzamogul



Joined: Jun 13, 2005

Post   Posted: Feb 27, 2009 - 18:05 Reply with quote Back to top

clarkin wrote:
Pizzamogul if you need someone to modify the java team scraper to implement these changes (once decided), let me know. I think i'm the last person to have done that for you.


I will definitely be in touch! Thank you.

_________________
"Don't expect mercy."
-Woodstock
pizzamogul



Joined: Jun 13, 2005

Post   Posted: Mar 02, 2009 - 16:55 Reply with quote Back to top

No comments on my ideas?

Seems I killed the discussion with my crazy suggestions.

_________________
"Don't expect mercy."
-Woodstock
MadTias



Joined: Jun 19, 2004

Post   Posted: Mar 03, 2009 - 21:16 Reply with quote Back to top

Coming in from another angle than previously then... B teams will have a hard time winning a season as long as we stick to the cycle for scoring. So I'd like a special badge (a shiny one) for the highest scoring B team. Smile
Mr_Foulscumm



Joined: Mar 05, 2005

Post   Posted: Mar 03, 2009 - 21:52 Reply with quote Back to top

MadTias wrote:
Coming in from another angle than previously then... B teams will have a hard time winning a season as long as we stick to the cycle for scoring. So I'd like a special badge (a shiny one) for the highest scoring B team. Smile


No, you choose to waste your time playing B. Learn to live with the failure. Very Happy
(Shiny badges are nice though.)

Quote:
TS within an acceptable range = 1 point
CR within an acceptable range = 1 point
Opposing team is "famous" (played >100 matches) = 1 point
Opposing coach has a legendary award (fouler, scorer, whatever) = 1 point
(Parameters can be different - these are just ideas) Etc...


What would be an acceptable range for the TS/CR then?

I do enjoy the looking for tougher games idea. And playing the "famous" teams and coaches is usually a lot of fun.

But the TR/CR bit still needs to be defined.

_________________
Everybody's favorite coach on FUMBBL
pizzamogul



Joined: Jun 13, 2005

Post   Posted: Mar 04, 2009 - 00:50 Reply with quote Back to top

Mr_Foulscumm wrote:
What would be an acceptable range for the TS/CR then?


What about something like "if you're under 150 CR, then you can play anybody and get the point. If you're over 150 CR then you have to play coaches also over 150 CR to get the point." And for TS, what about playing other teams within + or - 5 TS to get the point? Then we could offer another bonus point for harder match ups if that thrills everybody.

I'm trying to stick with the K.I.S.S. principle of match selection here, humor me!

And I think we should have an award for each league winner as MadTias suggests. I usually keep track of each league's leader in the weekly reports.

I'm thinking along the lines of a Black medallion for the highest scoring Blackbox team, Red for ranked, Green for faction, etc... And then we could have a bronze cycle emblem for completing the cycle, silver for no losses, and gold for all wins. I would likely keep the current category winners and overall trophies.

_________________
"Don't expect mercy."
-Woodstock
MadTias



Joined: Jun 19, 2004

Post   Posted: Mar 07, 2009 - 11:26 Reply with quote Back to top

pizzamogul wrote:

What about something like "if you're under 150 CR, then you can play anybody and get the point. If you're over 150 CR then you have to play coaches also over 150 CR to get the point."

Your own CR should prolly not enter into the equation, as it's gameable. Any system based on your own CR is open to abuse/powergaming.

EDIT: some thoughts on the rest of the post:
* Bonus points for harder matchups will probably encourage the suicidal match-ups that you were afraid of.
* Medallions sounds really good! Smile
Rufus_09



Joined: Aug 23, 2006

Post   Posted: Mar 18, 2009 - 21:58 Reply with quote Back to top

I like it pizza, its simple. Personally i stopped playing ELF because it became too time consuming to find a game that would score well (and my CR isnt even that high, must suck to be in the high 160's or even 170's).

I feel that not to offer some insentive to score high is un-elfy though. I mean what else is playing elves about apart from scoring touch downs, i do belive that a 3-1 win is better than a 2-1 win (any orc or dwarf team can stall a game out for a 2-1 win). But it need to be nothing major, maybe a top 3 scorers award for the season rather than a bounus each game. To ignore TDs altogether...well....we might as well be playing dwarves...there i said it, i cant unsay it.

On a side note, i loved the themed seasons. I have a different elf race for each of the different ELF seasons, giving me a reason to play the different races elves have to offer rather than just sticking to my woodies.

Keep up the good work, i hope to see ELF up and playable soon
eyeslikethunder



Joined: Aug 02, 2003

Post   Posted: Apr 18, 2009 - 10:57 Reply with quote Back to top

MadTias wrote:
pizzamogul wrote:

What about something like "if you're under 150 CR, then you can play anybody and get the point. If you're over 150 CR then you have to play coaches also over 150 CR to get the point."

Your own CR should prolly not enter into the equation, as it's gameable. Any system based on your own CR is open to abuse/powergaming.

EDIT: some thoughts on the rest of the post:
* Bonus points for harder matchups will probably encourage the suicidal match-ups that you were afraid of.
* Medallions sounds really good! Smile


i agree
but i feel their should a stepped bonuses for beating \drawing with a high cr coach. only ts\tr should be compared


otherwise people can just create fresh accounts cr150 and play with them or manage their cr down

Yeah love medals always added the cycle medal any team that completed. For me completing it was a challenge as i never really played regularly enough to do much more.

_________________
Proud Member of E.L.F.


There was this disturbance in the water, then suddenly this giant testicle came out and grabbed me
ibambe



Joined: Jun 27, 2005

Post   Posted: May 13, 2009 - 21:43 Reply with quote Back to top

I think LRB5 will be helpful. The good ELF match ups are loads of fun, but it gets frustrating when every third game you're unable to field a full team. Recovery games are often boring and tough to find. Maybe I just need to get better at keeping them from getting pounded.

Any planned start date for the next season?
Mr_Foulscumm



Joined: Mar 05, 2005

Post   Posted: Jun 01, 2009 - 19:32 Reply with quote Back to top

So how about that new E.L.F season I've been hearing about? Or maybe I just BUMPED my head? Wink

_________________
Everybody's favorite coach on FUMBBL
Uber



Joined: Mar 22, 2004

Post   Posted: Jun 24, 2009 - 08:29 Reply with quote Back to top

I must admit I've been out of E.L.F. and Fumbbl for a while, but since I'm one of the original founders and I happen to think I'm so wise, I might as well throw in something in the hat Wink

The idea of E.L.F. in the first place is to eliminate picking. The point that we were trying to make is that we would take on all contenders. Completing the cycle is very much in the spirit of the group, thus bringing elvish domination to all other races. If somewhere along the line it turned into a competition for racking up little trophies by picking on weaker opponents, then you've managed to completely miss the point.

I think everyone who completes the cycle should get a badge and if a grand winner and extra awards should be given at the end of a season, I think a simple vote by members should do the trick. Any scoring or point system can be abused in some way and it's just human nature to attempt to do so. A 1-0 against a tough team is sometime better than a 3-0 rout, however it doesn't seem worth it to create some complicated algorithm to have the 1-0 come out ahead when basic judgment can do just the same.

I like the idea of a democratic system in the league, it would put all E.L.F. team as equals. I would also suggest having some kind of team goal for the whole group, which everyone could contribute to. When we started E.L.F it was more about us vs. them than competing among ourselves. I would love to see E.L.F. teams dominate ranked tournaments, so maybe there's something to do in that regard.

Anyway, this is mostly food for thoughts, but I hope you guys will keep on going and find some way of making this work. Long live E.L.F.!

_________________
Official consiliere of the Northern Wastes League

Thinking comes before posting.
Mr_Foulscumm



Joined: Mar 05, 2005

Post   Posted: Jul 10, 2009 - 20:42 Reply with quote Back to top

Uber wrote:
however it doesn't seem worth it to create some complicated algorithm to have the 1-0 come out ahead when basic judgment can do just the same.


That could work, but one thing an algorithm does better then basic judgement is keeping it's feelings about the coach/team in question out of the equation.

Uber wrote:

I like the idea of a democratic system in the league, it would put all E.L.F. team as equals. I would also suggest having some kind of team goal for the whole group, which everyone could contribute to. When we started E.L.F it was more about us vs. them than competing among ourselves. I would love to see E.L.F. teams dominate ranked tournaments, so maybe there's something to do in that regard.


I always cheer the E.L.F teams in tours anyway. Very Happy
But we could move the group away from an internal competition and make it more about giving the other teams hell. Awards based more on goals met instead of a points total.


Also, I miss E.L.F Sad

_________________
Everybody's favorite coach on FUMBBL
Jakob_olsen



Joined: Nov 20, 2005

Post   Posted: Jul 13, 2009 - 11:26 Reply with quote Back to top

Mr_Foulscumm wrote:
Also, I miss E.L.F Sad


Me too.....

We have had the discussion - people have aired their opinions.
What E.L.F needs right now, (and the last few months) is for one of the group leaders to make some decisions and restart E.L.F.
Display posts from previous:     
 Jump to:   
All times are GMT + 1 Hour
Post new topic   Reply to topic
View previous topic Log in to check your private messages View next topic