the_Sage
Joined: Jan 13, 2011
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 Posted:
Jul 01, 2012 - 22:22 |
 
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| The_Murker wrote: | Just win baby. Big numbers bigger. Other players are just really great A.I.
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Especially when they suck! |
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The_Murker
Joined: Jan 30, 2011
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| Posted:
Jul 01, 2012 - 22:55 |
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Easy pickings and more CRystal for us.
CLAWPOMB Player = Specialized Battle Cruiser with Complete Offensive Weapons Suite
Basically, any one else sending out battle squadrons to the same reaches of the galaxy as you is in competition for your resources and needs to be crushed while minimizing the danger to your own squadron and CRystal hoard.
Central galactic civilizations only have so much warp gate energy to deploy squadrons into the outer regions to compete for CRystal. This is why similar size forces end up competing in a sector. The farther away you want to send a fleet, the smaller the force deployed needs to be. (small TV, small Transport eValuation cost) So if you only have so many Giga Tons of ships you can send, best send one GREAT BIG one, and the best support vessels you can with the rest of the enegry available. Makes sense. |
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xnoelx
Joined: Jun 05, 2012
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Jul 01, 2012 - 23:16 |
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Although I'm pretty much haemorrhaging CR, I like the idea. So maybe Fend = Repulsor Beam, TTM = Ship-to-ship Gravitational Slingshot Manoeuvre, nega-traits are system failures/attempted mutiny, MB = Advanced Targeting System, Sprint = Retrofitted Afterburners? |
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 Nerf Ball 2014 |
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JimmyFantastic
Joined: Feb 06, 2007
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| Posted:
Jul 01, 2012 - 23:26 |
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Just say no. |
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Pull down the veil - actively bad for the hobby! |
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Jeffro
Joined: Jan 22, 2009
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Jul 01, 2012 - 23:33 |
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The_Murker
Joined: Jan 30, 2011
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Jul 09, 2012 - 22:23 |
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Yea, so to round this off in a slightly more coherent fashion.. What I need to do to enjoy an unfair blood bowl game, to enjoy the idea of min/maxing, is what Blader has been doing for a long time. De-Blood Bowl-izing the entire game.
You need to forget that there is another person MOST LIKELY trying to enjoy the fantasy football aspect of the story that surrounds the game’s mechanics, and just make it about the numbers. And the rules, and scheduling. To win has to be the point. Rack up wins and coach ranking. For him that means putting ponies on everything and CLAWPOMBing his way to the top, or picking noobs.
For me, I had to come up with a different mind-set, and just realise that if winning is THE goal, than it doesn’t make sense to try and enjoy the fluff. Chaos dwarves are clearly the best, most consistent winning low TV new team. In the hands of a non-noob they have no weakness. Armor, skills, speed, anti-amazon. So they win. If I think of them as chaos dwarves, I hate them. If I think of them as the best chess piece, or the best space-ship in the game for the price, meh, I pick the best space-ship. Of course you pick the best space ship! Some people would pick the coolest looking space ship in a game. Or the one with the best name. But they shouldn’t complain when the one with the biggest guns keeps blowing their cool looking space-ship up. CD spaceships are the best.
So in Box, blader MADE some good playing pieces, and chooses to fight them in an arena where the opponent’s tend to have weak playing pieces. Why? Well why not? If he isn’t trying to enjoy a sportsmanlike fantasy football game, then who cares? He has de-humanized it and made it about moving up in CR. That’s a number that is there, so why not take a run at it? Like a teenager climbing the UNREAL ladder because he thinks it means something. And to complete that numerical (or status seeking) goal as quickly as possible it makes sense to min/max and tick it off quickly and efficiently.
“Why not?!?” ask so many of you. Because we want to play blood bowl, with lots of kinds of teams, collect some skills, and enjoy ourselves in different situations like we do in our gaming club. Good point. From that viewpoint blader is a douch, ruining the blackbox for all it could be. It could be just like your gaming club, available 24/7, with everyone welcome. Good times. Until someone who doesn’t shower shows up. But it’s not like that right now. And it’s Christer’s, not ours.
So either we agree (and make Big C agree) on a Black Box GOAL as a community, about fairness, about what fun challenges are, about how important fluff and team building are, or we just let it be. A place where the blader’s have the best chance of winning, and will create new Russian blader wannabees at the expense of the other players who enjoy the blood bowl world.
For now, I’m trying the chaos dwarf space-ships, and I’m not sick of it yet. I don’t think that you can argue that when coaches are both good, and team’s well built, Blood bowl can be over-simplified as a frustrating coin-toss. So even with the best playing pieces, and an “unfair” advantage, it is still SOMETIMES challenging to try not to lose. Often challenging, if you are as bad as I can be. The difference is, with AV, and CLAW, and skill-less enemy players, you can suffer the same HORRIBLE strings of luck that we all do and still have a chance to win. THAT is the challenge. Winning no matter what comes.
At low TV with your pumped team, even Nuffle can’t eliminate the chance that you win. And if winning is the goal, then every game can be rewarding. But perhaps not very challenging. No un-min/maxed team can say this unless the coach is a very experienced elf-baller.
So it makes sense that very experienced coaches hate this tactic. I suggest trying to remember yourself when you were not so good and just wanted to win.
And it makes sense that mid-range coaches who want to enjoy the fluff of “lesser” teams hate this tactic. They just can’t compete and it doesn’t seem fair. (I am firmly in this camp) I don’t really know what to suggest here. I think I realise now Box is a fluff-less land for all but the chaos teams. And for them, high TV games still are really just frustrating coin tosses. Whose POMB explodes first. I dunno. Fluff-wise it’s like the meaningless Chaos wasters when no-one rules for long.
I didn’t think I would ever see an appeal, as I love the fantasy football world and the human teams, but I’m going to temporarily refrain from fighting so hard against it, and at least try and understand the appeal. That, and I know Christer is busy with other big things at the moment. Nothing is about to change soon I fear. |
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easilyamused
Joined: Jun 06, 2008
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Jul 09, 2012 - 23:00 |
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At what point does it cross the line from using blader as an example to a personal attack? As this seems to be very close to the line.... |
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The_Murker
Joined: Jan 30, 2011
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Jul 10, 2012 - 08:16 |
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Sorry, it was an un-quoted comment from another thread. There it was a personal attack I beleive. |
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Join the wait-list. Watch the action. Leave the Empire. Come to Bretonnia! |
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Ehlers
Joined: Jun 26, 2006
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| Posted:
Jul 10, 2012 - 11:27 |
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| The_Murker wrote: | | For me, I had to come up with a different mind-set, and just realise that if winning is THE goal, than it doesn’t make sense to try and enjoy the fluff. |
Please describe what fluff is to you, because it seems only your idea of fluff is allowed in Blackbox. So blader is using his pony for his fluff and just metagame the blackbox. Why attack blader when it is CRP that is the evil thing? Why I cant believe that Blader is so attractive to those ponies, yet I have found myself watching several hours of that on youtube doing work.
| The_Murker wrote: | | Why? Well why not? If he isn’t trying to enjoy a sportsmanlike fantasy football game, then who cares? |
Since when is Blood Bowl a SPORTSMANLIKE fantasy football game? Have you read the old LRB4 rule book regarding fluff? That was not very sportsmanlike how the players, teams or their managers acted. Bringing a chainsaw is sportsmanlike or?
| The_Murker wrote: | | “Why not?!?” ask so many of you. Because we want to play blood bowl, with lots of kinds of teams, collect some skills, and enjoy ourselves in different situations like we do in our gaming club. |
Blackbox is not YOUR LOCAL gaming club. That is league!
Murker you have a serious issue with Blackbox, we get that. You have a serious issue with CRP, we get that. But to me Blader is playing the blackbox hardcore, which it always have been. LRB4 blackbox was hardcore to. If you faced a chaos team with DP and claw&razor&multi block you just knew it was going to be a T16 beatings. And if he also got the REF, OMG.
Your threads are becoming boring and tiresome of the personal hate and attacks. If you don’t like blackbox then play ranked or league. |
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The_Murker
Joined: Jan 30, 2011
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Jul 10, 2012 - 11:45 |
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I'm going to have to agree with everything you said, right up until the last two scentences. You're right. And I don't hate Blader. I'm wrapping my head around blader's game, begining to understand blader-types, and if I'm not careful, I might enjoy it if I look at it a certain way, until it gets repetitive. I have more on that topic coming too, so if it's boring to you.. don't read my threads. I've noticed alot of really well spoken and funny guys just stop posting here over the last year. I'd like to believe it's more about CRP and shadow type comments than about my posting, but you never know.
Thanks for your comments though. It gave me the oppertunity to divert the unintentional blader hate, who looks like he can stick up for himself pretty good. Go ponies. Fear my spaceships. |
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easilyamused
Joined: Jun 06, 2008
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Jul 10, 2012 - 13:01 |
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Hate on blader all you want, he's a big boy and if he has issues I'm sure he'll voice them. I just wanted to point out that you were getting a little close to breaking site rules on personal attacks. |
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Araznaroth
Joined: Oct 08, 2008
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Jul 10, 2012 - 14:18 |
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Are you a Trekkie by chance?! 
And don't hate the Pony, hate the Game! 
Edit; can't take the Pony, stay out of the paddock!
gonna stop now others come to mind but its getting too silly! |
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garyt1
Joined: Mar 12, 2011
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| Posted:
Jul 12, 2012 - 08:02 |
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I love to use a bit of fluff and still play in Blackbox. The characters/pixels may not last as long as I would like but that's how it goes. Also you might get more respect for a long lived non-pomber in the box than elsewhere.
I have written a match report for almost every game I play (often just summarising highlights/lowlights as a reminder) and have seen very few in response. I would love to see a few more opponents make reports, maybe that is more common in ranked. As for the bad games, they are not that common at low-mid tv really though there is the odd silent coach. I struggle to get up to 180tv even if not playing loads of clawpomb, though the Forgotten Villains are close to the danger zone. |
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The_Murker
Joined: Jan 30, 2011
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Jul 12, 2012 - 08:13 |
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Respect to the Black Box fluff.
Villianey & Love.
Thanks for the encouragement koadah. My Conference sprint starts today.
Hey gary1.. race your fluffy box team to 200 games. Whatá ya say? |
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garyt1
Joined: Mar 12, 2011
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Jul 12, 2012 - 08:31 |
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Well, we are a bit behind and that will be one slow race! Now I have a few teams I don't use them every week. But yeah, an incentive to go way past 100!
Looks like you must have taken some beatings recently judging by the rookie players. Good team bio and nice to see some reports. |
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“A wise man can learn more from a foolish question than a fool can learn from a wise answer.” |
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