Posted by Muff2n on 2020-12-14 12:50:15
A very inventive change.
I find this team to be an interesting thought experiment and I want to challenge you on how you determined their costs! (Please take this as a probing question for my enlightenment and not an attack).
How was the value of regen determined? I look at the roster (before sprites change) and compare them to pro elves. I think the roster is a bit worse than pro elves (higher RR cost, no apo, bit worse positionals). But they all have regen, which looks to be costed at 20k per player. So across a team that is 220k minimum. In order for the regen to 'pay off', they need to suffer in excess of 2*220k = 440k in 'player cost casualties'. By this I mean the sum of the TW of the players that suffered a CAS in the game. And I think that should be the value of the player not including this 20k regen cost. Because if a rookie sister regens from a CAS, her value to the team is about 60k (pro elf lineman). The fact that she has regen is not relevant here - if she gets CAS'd again then that would count a second time.
Secondly the value of the regen increases with the bash potential of the opposing team. This seems hard to balance (in an elf mirror you are just a lot of value down).
All in all, I find it difficult to see how the regen is worth it, except for very high TV against a bash team. But I also recognize that it would be crazy to value regen at less that 20k (especially when you only have 10k increments). So I'm left with the belief that 20k for regen is the wrong cost but it is also the right cost. Can you help me out please and put my tortured mind to ease?!
Posted by Garion on 2020-12-14 13:39:21
Yes regen = 30k for team creation officially.
However skills en masse can be discounted 10k. See Slann.
So yes regen= 20k here, so slightly discounted.
Also in team creation any player thats value is over 100k has a special discount. E.g. if your player is 100k then you give the player 3 skills when designing them that would be 160k. The 60k is the halved which equals 130k then you can adjust 10k either way for balance.
Because of this design rule every naiad you add to your squad makes you more tv efficient. Also you have easy access to leader which makes your team more tv efficient.
All that said. This is not meant to be a tier1 team, they're meant to be a challenge. In the official teams all elves are tier1 and amazing. In sl we have a couple of tier2 elf teams.
Posted by Muff2n on 2020-12-14 13:56:42
Thanks for the response. So you came at it from a formulaic perspective. I was thinking of how 11 rookie sisters cost about 15 rookie pro elves. I'd much rather have 15 rookie pro elves because I'd need to suffer over 8 CAS in the game before the sisters could be expected to have a numbers advantage. Until then, for each CAS or KO suffered the pro elves are expected to have the numbers advantage. Obviously that value of 8 decreases the player costs increase (due to naiads and leveling up).
An interesting abuse just occurred to me: Hire 4 sprites and fire them after game 1. That way you can get 4 journey sisters ;)
Posted by Nelphine on 2020-12-14 14:01:07
Yeah, I've always believed those official rules to be wrong about regen (among other things), and in my system regen only costs 10k.
Posted by Garion on 2020-12-14 14:09:56
" An interesting abuse just occurred to me: Hire 4 sprites and fire them after game 1. That way you can get 4 journey sisters ;)"
yes this is why I did not give them Spites when the roster was first released. However it is just too limiting at rookie level without the Spites, I also think now that the TV increase would be an unwanted one anyway, until you have a couple of skills. So its not such an issue.