Posted by koadah on 2021-10-15 19:13:00
Quit moaning and join [SL16] ;)
Posted by MrCushtie on 2021-10-15 19:14:02
I'm keen to see if you feel better or worse after you've got some games in with those Black Orcs of yours in Competitive.
Much league play yet?
Posted by MattDakka on 2021-10-15 19:36:20
Keep on moaning, don't listen to koadah! Moaning is fun and part of the hobby! :P
Giving many reasons to complain about is one of the few positive sides of this ruleset.
The other 2 are the Kick-Off Table nerf and the Clawmb nerf.
Seriously speaking, as you said, we'll still play it because it's Blood Bowl, but not how we like it.
The level-ups used to be fun, now they are boring.
Posted by Tesifonte on 2021-10-15 19:38:43
Here here mate.
*brings some drinks along and sits by Malmir*
Have a drink, and speak your heart. That's part of being human, right? : )
Posted by Rbthma on 2021-10-15 20:37:25
Neither agreeing or disagreeing at this point as it feels early without redraft and box matchmaking.
I still enjoy team/player building as well as more competitive teams so I have some plans for various inefficient builds but really need to see how it all interacts. Perhaps there's wriggle room on the TV cap?
No pressure on the developers ofc, great job so far!
Posted by Joost on 2021-10-15 21:21:52
I agree - it's less fun but ogres / snots / black orcs I still enjoy. My main gripe is the way skilling up happens now (boring) and the lack of teams over, say, 1300 TV. I'll miss the 2K TV lizards trying to survive the chaos nightmares.
But...... 'less fun' to me will still mean 'fun enough to play regular games'. Especially when travelling for work
Posted by Mingoose on 2021-10-15 21:54:16
- new skills suck, but I guess they had to with random skills, but random skills is a dumb mechanic that leads to min/maxing anyway
- Secondary skills aren't worth 40 tv, meaning you are forced to gamble, and may get a terrible skill not even worth the 20 tv
- Getting thrown off on a 1 on a kickoff event is so much worse than a rock. The kickoff table has hardly been nerfed
- new injury table is destructive, and makes APOs terrible at their job
- Claw/MB nerfed, but Morg gets +2 MB???
- Dedicated Fans no longer handicaps teams on a winning streak, which I think is bad, FF handicap was a good part of the game
It's still blood bowl though, plays essentially the same, just slightly worse.
Posted by Verminardo on 2021-10-15 22:05:48
The new fouling dynamic is actually one of the few changes I don't find terrible. That said, I've spent the better part of this year hating on the new rules. I find it hard to get over how much I hate what GW is doing, and that they can get away with it. I find it hard to fathom how many people actually seem to think the new rules are good. But there is no use, absolutely none, in giving going down that line of thought again and again. You will still be one of the best coaches of the world in the new rules, and I will still be one of the, eh, good enough coaches. ;-) It's good to see all this activity, it's good to see table top tourneys starting back up, I have to say, after playing hardly any games since December, it's good to have the itch back.
Posted by HaruHaru on 2021-10-15 22:12:36
Nobody likes someone who whines or gloats, there are more modalities than those two and that's also why no one who knows you wants to play against you Matt.
Anyway, I like the fouling changes and I like the random skills, it creates more of a challenge to create the ultimate players.
Posted by MattDakka on 2021-10-15 22:38:25
Matt: 62 games played in Competitive division.
HaruHaru: 15 games played in Competitive division.
Looks like I find more people to play with than HaruHaru.
I'm fine, thanks, don't worry about me, I can find games.
Posted by HaruHaru on 2021-10-15 23:16:39
I've played 15 competitive games in the off-season of my favourite league trying to get used to the new ruleset. I mainly play in leagues because I think it's arguably the best way to play Blood Bowl and like everyone else I am entitled to my own opinion on how to best enjoy the game.
Not that this is in any way relevant to this blog post but I'm reminded by the thread about a new gamefinder that smallman made and I do agree with you on some points but for very different reasons.
I don't like gamefinder because I feel it makes me pick and I don't like being "that guy". You don't like gamefinder because you have to sit in that window for hours and hours and wait for a "fair" or an advantageous offer for you. If people let you, you would pick chorfs into amazons and stunties every day of the week so you could boost your CR by 0.001 and grow your E-peen ever so slightly with each game.
I think that's the main difference between us.
Oh, and sure, you're probably still a better player than me, I'd expect as much when you've spent more than 15 times the amount I have on the game.
We did play that one time while I still was in my double digits and I still remember how much I disliked playing against you.
Posted by HaruHaru on 2021-10-15 23:30:05
Also, just because you love stats so much, I've played about 120 games in 16 months or so. (15th June 2020)
These 120 games:
15 were competitive games with the new bb20 rules.
1 was a teaching game which I called a little early because it was getting late.
82 were league games.
19 were Blackbox games.
1 was a pick-up game in stunty leeg with a friend.
2 games were casual games against a RL friend.
So not that 15 games are a lot but they are a sizeable portion of my recent games.
Posted by Supa on 2021-10-15 23:33:55
I wonder if leagues should houserule the concept of MNG away and just allow players to play on the next game. Even niggles and perms can keep playing with their respective injuries, and dead is dead of course.
Posted by MattDakka on 2021-10-15 23:35:33
A coach offered a match Amazons vs my Chorfs but I didn't accept, for the record.
It would have been unfair for him. So, the selection works both ways and you have just prejudices.
Honestly I didn't remember you, I had to check our match record. Nice that you remember me, though.
Anyway, sooner or later we will have the Box.
Posted by mekutata on 2021-10-15 23:47:18
I kinda like it to be honest.
Posted by Verminardo on 2021-10-16 00:13:40
I too look forward to the Box, whatever it will be called, even if it means I'll have to play against Dakka again. ;-))
Posted by HaruHaru on 2021-10-16 00:51:59
Matt, are you for real?
I said that I vehemently disliked playing against you and your first reaction was happiness that I remembered you? I think you need to see someone mate, this isn't healthy behaviour.
Posted by JackassRampant on 2021-10-16 04:50:06
Uh, yeah, my jury's still out. I do miss random skill-ups, and Wildly Inaccurate is a big mistake.
Posted by Malmir on 2021-10-16 06:27:33
I must add that I think the developers have done a fantastic job and I really like the new icons. I also totally understand why Christer went with the new rules and it is nice to see new blood on the site (not just the pitch). It's only the rules themselves I'm not keen on.
Posted by Mingoose on 2021-10-16 07:06:41
+1 for the development. Every single one of the new mechanics has been intuitive. It took me a minute to grasp how brawler, pro, and a team RR show up on a block, but it was implemented perfectly.
Posted by ivanybw on 2021-10-16 16:38:15
i do really prefere this ruleset, by far. pros are so mutch, and cons meh dunno. just my two cents
Posted by Joost on 2021-10-16 21:02:48
Playing a game today, i realised the thing that takes out some excitement for me is the multiple reroll per turn rule. It used to be more exciting when the opponent used the rr - turnovers can happen any moment now! Except that is now no longer the case. So, i miss large teams, the excitement of skill rolls and this.
The kick off table has improved and I like the prayers. The longer OT I think is a good thing but not sure yet.
And many thanks to the devs as mentioned. Fabulous work.
Posted by Harad on 2021-10-17 10:53:21
Imho you are right. New rules turned me off. Of course we may all disagree on the goals of a change to the rules but it’s the execution which really disappointed me.
Posted by muaddib68 on 2021-10-17 12:40:02
i feel exactly the same actually..
Posted by MattDakka on 2021-10-17 12:50:44
I had mixed feelings about the multiple rrs per turn.
They help teams lacking core skills and reduce the chance of messing a turn due to bad early dice (classic example is double skull first block).
On the other hand they make more likely action sequences which used to be quite unlikely in the old rules.
So, I think it would have been better to stick to the old "1 rr per turn" rule instead of messing the game by allowing multiple rrs per turn.
If they really wanted to make the game less punishing then allowing 2 rrs per turn could have been a right compromise. Not more than 2, though.
Posted by Mingoose on 2021-10-17 17:05:51
Multiple RR punishes sloppy offense. In BB2016, it was commonly accepted that barring luck you were usually trying to dictate when your opponent scores, not if. Multiple RR allows a defender to make some crazy plays that even up the phases. Making two dodges, 2 gfi and a block was usually too much to bite off, but if you have 3 RR to burn that sequence is no problem. The big question now is which turn to blow your blunderbuss full of RR.