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Christer
Last seen 8 hours ago
Tomb Kings
Star
Tomb Kings
Record
59/24/38
Win Percentage
59%
Shambling Undead
Super Star
Shambling Undead
Record
51/5/10
Win Percentage
81%
Overall
[R]
Star
Overall
Record
230/56/81
Win Percentage
70%
Archive

2020

2020-12-09 11:20:11
rating 6
2020-11-30 18:03:36
rating 5.8
2020-10-13 11:59:57
rating 5.9
2020-08-08 22:48:43
rating 5.8
2020-08-07 21:32:26
rating 5.9
2020-03-18 14:09:47
rating 6

2019

2019-12-13 21:32:02
rating 6
2019-11-25 16:00:40
rating 5.9
2019-04-14 23:33:08
rating 6
2019-04-07 16:59:39
rating 6
2019-04-07 00:55:26
rating 6
2019-01-08 15:27:38
rating 5.9
2019-01-05 02:58:18
rating 5.8

2018

2018-08-17 17:28:31
rating 6
2018-08-15 00:05:40
rating 6
2018-07-17 20:17:40
rating 6
2018-06-28 14:28:08
rating 5.9
2018-05-23 17:55:10
rating 6
2018-05-10 22:42:46
rating 6
2018-05-09 19:42:28
rating 6
2018-04-30 10:44:23
rating 5.8
2018-04-23 12:33:02
rating 5.8

2017

2017-04-23 18:06:35
rating 6
2017-04-06 23:00:56
rating 6
2017-04-03 19:06:00
rating 6
2017-03-29 22:35:46
rating 6
2017-03-25 16:18:39
rating 6
2017-03-11 21:24:26
rating 6
2017-02-14 14:23:58
rating 6
2017-02-10 14:54:03
rating 6

2016

2016-11-30 00:04:21
rating 6
2016-11-27 23:40:04
rating 6
2016-11-17 18:18:07
rating 6

2015

2015-09-06 23:59:26
rating 6
2015-01-24 15:56:29
rating 6
2015-01-22 13:10:32
rating 6
2015-01-19 21:20:53
rating 6
2015-01-10 19:03:45
rating 6

2014

2014-09-09 15:35:53
rating 6

2013

2013-04-26 11:48:40
rating 5.7

2012

2012-12-18 17:37:29
rating 5.9
2012-11-18 18:19:19
rating 6
2012-09-25 13:47:16
rating 5.6
2012-08-15 12:31:53
rating 5.9
2012-08-10 23:12:22
rating 5.9
2012-06-27 22:53:48
rating 5.9
2012-04-10 11:56:38
rating 5.9
2012-03-07 13:52:00
rating 5.9
2012-02-16 16:59:56
rating 5.9
2012-02-04 19:00:41
rating 5.3

2011

2011-07-25 23:32:43
rating 5.6
2011-05-23 13:12:52
rating 5.6
2011-02-04 14:26:18
rating 5.4

2010

2010-03-26 11:38:41
rating 5.1
2010-03-01 12:16:53
rating 5.6

2009

2009-12-08 16:40:30
rating 5.8

2008

2008-09-11 14:47:19
rating 4.1
2008-02-26 21:16:54
rating 5.3
2008-01-21 01:01:58
rating 5.6

2007

2007-11-06 21:23:14
rating 5.1
2007-10-16 00:26:11
rating 5.4
2007-09-30 17:10:03
rating 5.4
2007-09-30 12:01:42
rating 5.3
2007-08-09 12:14:57
rating 4.5
2007-08-06 12:02:52
rating 4.9
2007-08-03 17:56:21
rating 5.4
2020-11-30 18:03:36
33 votes, rating 5.8
BB2020 - Slann
So, in my November current thinking blog post, I mentioned that Slann will no longer be accepted into the competitive division, and initial responses in the forum thread appear to be focusing on it more than I expected. Because of this, I want to write something about my thinking behind this decision. Perhaps you won't agree with me, but I hope that you will at least understand my position and not think it's completely arbitrary.

First some background about the Slann. They were added to FUMBBL when the Blood Bowl Rules Committee (BBRC) was a thing, and a number of people from the "Blood Bowl Community" were working with Games Workshop to improve the rules and make the game better. For reasons beyond the scope of this blog post, this cooperative rules design ended and the BBRC was dissolved. As this was happening, the BBRC had essentially green-lit the Slann as a roster to be included, but GW chose to veto the roster for inclusion and they never officially saw the light of day. At this point, GW chose to publish what's called the Competitive Rules Pack (CRP) rules, which were essentially the rulebook with all the fluff and flavour text removed in favour of a strict set of rules and nothing else. At the same time, a version of what "could have been" showed up from an unknown third party (the name Icepelt was used at the time) which was more or less Living Rulebook 6 (LRB6); the name stemming from what the rules were called during the BBRC "era". This LRB6 set of rules included the Slann as a roster and was largely adopted by the community as about as official as it could be without being published by GW. FUMBBL, as well as The NAF, adopted the Slann as official.

Over time, Cyanide's Blood Bowl games appeared, and GW released BB2016. This resulted in a situation where what's "official" was further diluted. We now had three separate sources for rules and rosters: GW, The NAF and Cyanide. I chose to not implement the Cyanide rosters on FUMBBL because I didn't deem them "official enough" at the time, and it was easier to leave things be than make the statement and change.

So before the bb2020 rules, FUMBBL was somewhat confused in direction. We allowed the Slann in the competitive divisions, but not the Khorne Daemons, or other Cyanide rosters. With the continued development of BB and BB2, Cyanide's version of the game has become something that a lot of people are used to, with it being their initial encounter with the game.

Now, with bb2020, I have the opportunity to clean up what I feel is a statement of non-support for Cyanide's games and clarify the position of what I feel the competitive division(s) should be: A pure implementation of the official ruleset.

Now, The NAF have published a document showing their suggested roster for Slann and by doing so adopted the responsibility for them. While they are a large organization that I have a lot of respect for and hope for a very long cooperation with, this is essentially a house ruled roster they have come up with rules for. They are not an official source of rules, nor do they want to be (as far as I am aware).

Cyanide has developed and effectively published rosters as well in their games. Some are only available in their first game and are essentially deprecated, others are not. What happens with BB3 is anyone's guess (although rumour has it they're more strictly controlled by GW on what they're allowed to add).

So, coming back to FUMBBL and Slann.

The core tenant that matters here is that FUMBBL has from day one been a project intending to keep to the official rules. In my opinion, GW is the only truly official source of rules for the game. I simply can't draw the line in the sand and say The NAF is official and Cyanide is not. I can't justify saying that Garion's work on Secret League is less official than The NAF's Slann roster. I can't decide if Simyin is more official than Cyanide's rosters.

All of these options are, and will continue to be, options as part of the custom ruleset feature on the site. The League division is an important part of FUMBBL's identity at this point; this is where The NAF have been running their tournaments and this is where Garion runs Secret League.

Slann were available in the competitive divisions because they were so close to the border of being official that I chose to identify them as such. Partly to show appreciation to the members of the BBRC for their work with a game which had been essentially dead for years prior to their involvement.

With the BB2016 updates to rosters, and the large BB2020 change of system, any version of the Slann published outside of GW (who are likely to never introduce them), I can't justify Slann as anything but a house rule and as such I believe they well and truly belong in the league division.

And with that, I don't think I can be more clear about my opinion regarding Slann. I hope you understand my position even if you don't agree with it.
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Comments
Posted by Foremole on 2020-11-30 18:27:59
Thank you for all that you do. I know it isn't easy making these choices, but I appreciate your thought process and well documented in this case.
Posted by Halfabrain on 2020-11-30 18:36:33
Thanks for all the hard work Christer, we are all very grateful.
Posted by JanMattys on 2020-11-30 19:01:03
I'm not a fan of your decision, mainly because a close friend of mine is a Slann enthusiast and is now heartbroken of not being able to use them on fumbbl where it matters, but I understand the reasons behind it.
Posted by TheFear on 2020-11-30 19:02:03
Fantastic and well reasoned explanation. For what its worth - I agree with you.
Posted by DrDeath on 2020-11-30 19:08:25
Thanks Christer, I under your position even if I don't agree with it :D But if the site has a policy of sticking with the 'official rules' then fair enough I suppose (even if the new rules look absolutely dire in my opinion). It is a great shame though that one of the most innovative teams, designed by the great Jervis Johnson that gave a completely new style of playing, should suddenly be axed merely because it doesn't fit the dreamland of the nerd police in a UK office. The ruleset they have come up with will, I think, result in a lot more grinding running plays with very little passing or leaping, so I think a lot of coaches will soon miss slann hugely (I certainly will).

I could go on about the dogs' dinner they have made of passing (does anyone understand what is going on there? Seems certain it is worse though, unbelievably), hit and run foulers, making dwarfs even more broken in their low TV sweetspot, the unsuitability of a 1350 TV cap for many playing environments (particularly online ones such as FUMBBL), and am very tempted to lol! But of course that is absolutely not your fault if you have a straight policy of sticking to the official ruleset, no matter how bad it may be.

Can I ask one question though please? Will League have options to raise the TV bar, extend seasons or even deactivate them entirely, maybe even play with the old ruleset or ignore certain bits of the new one such as passing? Asking as a League Commissioner - my RSL league only runs the famous teams, in particular if we have to stick to 1350 it will become rather pointless. The whole point is to run the big famous teams, so repeatedly sacking 3/4 of the famous players of the Chaos All Stars/ Gouged Eye/ Elfheim Eagles etc would be extremely unfun. I expect many other leagues will also want to know?

Must say I have lost a lot of my appetite for R and B games with these changes, but if we have at least got some 'sandbox' flexibility in League that would be something.

Thanks again for all your hard work on this site over the years, my gripes above are entirely to do with the new GW 'game designers' and not you!
Posted by Zlefin on 2020-11-30 20:01:49
A very well thought explanation; it makes things alot clearer and covers the difficult choices involved in making the decision.
Posted by Jeffro on 2020-11-30 20:17:30
As always, I cannot find any reason to not accept your well reasoned and thoughtful approach to running this site. Thank you.
Posted by Lyracian on 2020-11-30 20:49:35
While I like Slann I am very happy with your decision and your well reasoned argument. Thank for you taking the time to outline the details.
Posted by HorridDave on 2020-11-30 21:38:27
what about kislev?
Posted by koadah on 2020-12-01 00:08:18
@DrDeath: Yes, there'll be options.

https://fumbbl.com/p/ruleset?id=652
Posted by sann0638 on 2020-12-01 09:01:06
Fair enough. (tenet, not tenant, for info...)
Posted by Joemanji on 2020-12-01 09:15:48
You are the boss. Taking something away from people is very different from not giving it to them in the first place though.
Posted by Garion on 2020-12-01 09:55:33
Slann will be fully playable in Secret League. Obviously not to everyone's taste, but the option is there if you want it :)
Posted by Topas on 2020-12-01 14:12:38
One of the BB rulebooks said (and probably still says) that the Commish has complete power. And so be it. Thanks for the clear explanation nonetheless.

That being said, I hope that Cyanide continues to have Kislev and that GW eventually introduces them officially. That would solve so many problems ... but this is probably never going to happen.
Posted by Calthor on 2020-12-01 15:26:27
A sad day. I love Slann. Understandable and logical decision though.
Posted by Endzone on 2020-12-01 19:20:04
Thanks Christer. A well reasoned decision as always. Huge thanks for all you do.

I think it is a shame that GW missed a trick here because Slann were quite a unique team that offered something new and interesting. They were around from the early days of the fluff - my first introduction to them was in second edition around 30 years ago so it is a shame they are confined to the house rule leagues. Maybe something for GW to reconsider when they release their next expansion. I think a 're-officialisation' of Slann would be welcomed by many in the BB community.
Posted by DrDeath on 2020-12-05 21:37:33
@koadah - thanks for the link, great to know we will have at least some options in League! I think I will only be playing there soon frankly.

Just to add on slann, I agree with others it's a terrible shame and hope they are reintroduced at some point - although I very much doubt they will as they seem to have pretty much written them out elsewhere too.

I think Joemanji pretty much summed it up elseswhere - to paraphrase, it is one thing to take away something which people never had. But to give people a gift and then snatch it away again is really poor.

You wouldn't do that in real life would you? Obviously GW don't give a damn about their customers who bothered to paint up Slann teams. Thankfully the NAF have kept them in their 2021 tournament rules pack - look forward to playing mine again on TT at least :/ The NAF 2021 tournament rules pack also makes the new rules optional - tournament organisers can also choose 'classic' and keep to the old ruleset. I think that speaks volumes - really says a lot about what experienced players on the NAF think about the new rules as a whole.